How does the Sun square Pluto manifest itself in your life?

My father has this aspect in his chart and I have always been trying to understand it better. (sun in the 1st house square pluto)

I think the reason it is so interesting to me is because the Sun and Pluto have different energies (Pluto= darkness, Sun= light)

I have moon opposition pluto, but i don't have any planets square pluto.

I was just wondering if anyone who has this aspect could explain it better? I would really appreciate it

This is what I have read so far...

-it causes depression, anxiety,
-can cause a person to attract challenging situations to their lives
-is a difficult aspect to handle
- has to do with internal energies

I have this aspect but there are some important points that should be covered before much explanation of the aspect itself is given.

First of all, you have to shed a number of conceptions built in to the English language about "light" and "dark". These concepts cloud clear thinking and obscure or prevent understanding. It is only under the influence of the church that the concepts "good" and "evil" acquired colors, namely "light" and "dark", and that those colors became adjectives to describe good and bad. This is the case most clearly in English...think of such phrases as "black eye", "black balled", "white lie", "black listed"....etc. Heaven, god and angels are all depicted as bright and shining while the devil and all things related are always dark, ugly etc.

This all has roots in medieval church England and still warps the American mind to this day. This is much more deeply embedded in the British mind and consciousness. It's their culture and worldview, literally. I see you're Canadian, so it would follow that you've inherited this mode of thought as well, with perhaps a few variations. I have a good Canadian friend and I've noticed some of these variations. It's interesting. But I digress....

In Traditional cultures and civilizations the world over, "dark" or "black" simply meant the "unseen" or the "unknown". Hence the Chinese phrase "white face, black heart"......meaning, "white face" means your face or your outward image is easily seen and known, transparent almost, while "black heart" means your heart is unknowable, impenetrable, unfathomable even. Another example comes from Lao Tzu, the father of Taoism, who said, "The world is full of those who shine. I alone am dark." Of course, this dualism is most clearly illustrated in the Chinese symbol for Yin and Yang, with the Yin being black and the Yang being white. The Yin has the color black because it is unknown or hard to know, difficult to fathom, indirect in its movement etc. Yang is white because it is very easy to see and know, external and extroverted etc.

This has nothing to do with "good" or "bad". Nothing could be further from the truth.

If we look back to the original Greek meaning of the word Pluto, it meant "hidden" "wealthy" and "great" because Pluto controlled the vast riches under the surface of the earth.

So when you describe Pluto as "dark" you're probably putting a value to it that it simply does not possess. However, if we use the concept "dark" as meaning "hidden", "unseen", "Unknown" then we begin to understand the true nature of Pluto.

Pluto is the energy of all deep, hidden but extremely pure, true and powerful forces. It is epitomized by the deepest drives of Life itself, and when consciously known and directed it embodies the Will.

The Sun is in fact very similar to Pluto but it moves much faster. The Sun is the Life Force itself and determines the way one's light or Essence is directed, focused and developed.

Because they are so similar but so different, when they get together in aspect it is always an intense affair.

When they clash, as in a square, it can be volcanic in the sense of explosive and destructive but it can also be volcanic in the sense of moving great things and clearing the way for new growth and development.

Pluto does both- death and rebirth, fundamental irrevocable change and clearing away the superficial.

Pluto will challenge one's Sun/Identity to be true to what one really is. The fake and superficial will eventually be exposed. In a square, people may or may not be up to this challenge. This depends on the rest of the chart.

I have personally experienced Pluto transits to my Sun and the Sun square Pluto aspect to be very intense, demanding and rewarding because all superficialities are exposed and eliminated. This leaves me clear and hungry for the next challenges and opportunities and infinitely more grounded and steel in who and what I am.

I can see how depression and such could come from this aspect if a person is not ready or equipped to handle the intensity of these two forces in square. Depending on how close/tight the aspect is, they may or may not have room to wiggle, as I call it, basically breathing room to collect themselves before the next challenge.

i'm no astrology expert but with your moon and sun in hard aspect to pluto it could **POTENTIALLY** signify problems with your parents...perhaps they were controlling or extremely overpowering....i dont have this in my chart so i cant say for sure. but this is one way it could come into play from what ive read.
hope that helps a little

astrology02 said:

My father has this aspect in his chart and I have always been trying to understand it better. (sun in the 1st house square pluto)

I think the reason it is so interesting to me is because the Sun and Pluto have different energies (Pluto= darkness, Sun= light)

I have moon opposition pluto, but i don't have any planets square pluto.

I was just wondering if anyone who has this aspect could explain it better? I would really appreciate it

This is what I have read so far...

-it causes depression, anxiety, [I don't feel this fits my perception at least]
-can cause a person to attract challenging situations to their lives
-is a difficult aspect to handle
- has to do with internal energies

Click to expand...

So if sun is in first then pluto will be angular either 4th or 10th (these are parental house) and suggests ONE of his parents were controlling, demanding, manipulative even..

Angular houses are the most visiable in a chart, like being in a 'shop window'

signs of depression
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showpost.php?p=333419&postcount=26
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showpost.php?p=333420&postcount=27

when any sun sign receives a 'hard aspect' from an 'outer' malific planet it will overshadow the sun's rays to something like the outer planet functions. So if it's pluto it becomes more scorpio/pluntian. If is saturn then more cappi/saturnian etc etc....

now without having sight of the chart --- the easy aspects to sun espec will mitigate major problems. for example if sun were trine jupiter, sextile mars, trine moon ......

We simply do not act out just one aspect within our charts at any one time, as we are ALL multi faceted human beings...

Sun and Pluto are prone to inner tension and negative, self-destructive behavior. When things are going well, they suffer from fears that something will come along to change that. Their thought patterns can be negative, and if not kept in check, they can seriously undermine their happiness. Constantly worrying that the rug will be pulled from under their feet can easily become a self-fulfilling prophecy.
http://www.cafeastrology.com/natal/sunplutoaspects.html

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To read the full article, click on links

shows a tendency for willfulness to build up in your nature. As the pressures become greater, you are apt to explode. This may be a puzzlement to those around you because most of the time you are so self-restrained and in perfect control. Perhaps there is a frustrated ambition for power and authority. This is an aspect often associated with a "revolutionary spirit." There is an enigma in your personality, and you are defensive about forming close emotional ties. You have executive ability and the talent for managing ambitious enterprises.
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/sunaspects.html#suspl

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Your will can be relentless and you have a keen eye for the imperfections in your fellow man. Remember though, that they may not take kindly to your efforts to overhaul them, even if it is for their own good. Instead, work to make whatever changes are necessary within yourself so that you can lead by example rather than force. You have charisma and magnetism working for you. You might get into the habit of toning yourself down so that other less courageous souls can "handle" you. Fine, but try not to lose yourself completely in the process.
http://www.skyviewzone.com/astrology/aspectssun.htm#nasuasppl

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Astrologer50,

I have already studied astrology by myself and with an astrologer. From what I've learned, Sun square Pluto is a transit. When the Sun squares Pluto, the individual seeks to manipulate her or his life for personal gain. But I see that I did miss the first poster's question referring to it as an aspect. I interpreted the question as a transit, which is not so different from it as an aspect as the same planetary combinations are involved, though as an aspect, the person must live with it daily. Patience is definitely a lesson for both transit and aspect.

Just an apology everyone, for my former angry comments. I never get so high strung or upset. It must be that recent solar eclipse that brings out the intensity of the moment. Stay well!

[deleted response to attacking remarks - Moderator]

Compromise has a place as does force. I never said Force was a preference, simply that is usually the modus operandi of Sun squ Pluto, internal, external or both.

And since we are talking about Sun squ Pluto, Force is generally the name of the game, just as it is with the creation of Steel.

If you want compromise you're better off with Jupiter and Venus. Pluto is relentless and merciless. Sun is proud and entrenched. The square between them is not likely to see compromise- UNLESS Venus or Jupiter are involved.

Understand, I've lived with the aspect, with Mars square Pluto and experienced the transits of Pluto Opposite Sun and Mars.

Not the thread to debate astrology itself on, to all

All,

This is NOT a thread to debate astrology on. If you want to do that, go to the Chat section and start up an astrology debate there. This thread is only for listing how you experienced Sun square Pluto in your life. If you did NOT experience anything during your Sun square Pluto period or want to debate astrology, please do NOT post on this thread. I will continue to delete off-topic posts.

Back on subject,

Tim

HeyPlayGirl said:

your moon and sun in hard aspect to pluto it could **POTENTIALLY** signify problems with your parents...perhaps they were controlling or extremely overpowering....

Click to expand...

Pluto conjoints my Moon and squares my Sun.
My grandmother had these aspects as well (Her Pluto squared my Pluto).

I get a long great with my parents, just the normal stuff. Nothing serious or long lasting. My mother can be a little bit manipulative at times, but not in a frustrating way. It doesn't effect me.
I know some persons who have no aspects between Moon/Sun and Pluto and are dealing with a lot of serious parents related problems.

What I can add, is that my grandmother hadn't have an easy life. Coming from a difficult background she managed to change her life for the better.

During the transit of Pluto conjoining my Sun and squaring my Pluto and Moon (and semi-squaring my Venus and sesuiquidrating my Saturn), I was very creative and organised some social group events. With Pluto in Virgo in my natal 11th House, Sun in Saggiturius in House 3, I was in charge of the communications strategy.

I feel that the 'Pluto squaring my Sun-aspect' makes me a creative person. I have a strong need to create. That also means creating my own life (like my grandmother did).
I love to transform my self conscience.

People who don't know me well, think sometimes that I am lighthearted and cheerful (my Saggiturius-Sun), but I have a dark side, that likes intimidating men. I have a desire to challenge them. I don't know if that is Pluto squaring Sun. I have also Venus, Mars and Jupiter in Scorpio. To be honest, I love to attract men by ignoring them
I am not depressive by nature. I once had a depression when Saturn was transiting my Sun-Pluto-square, I guess it was more a Saturn-thing.

I hope these remarks will help you to understand your father.

Edit: Moved to here.

It's not boring. It's very interesting. I don't have that aspect though..

I never thought I would write here again, if it wasn't for the eclipses we had and two friendly and familiar faces I see just above me. I don't know how or why, but the Sun square Pluto aspect is clear now, and this is the message that I should have given first.

To have the Sun square Pluto aspect, a person is not at ease with his or her self. The person believes that the self is not as valuable as the selves of others. Instinct, represented by Pluto, acts on the person so he or she is able to acquire information about other people in contact through unseen channels. The personality expression, the Sun, acts on this information through feelings of insecurity and fear, specifically that the person is not as valuable as those other people in contact to him or her. This insecurity and fear pushes the person to compete with and succeed over those other people in contact to the point that the person is continuously dissatisfied and disappointed with his or her self, that the self must be forced to succeed at all costs, even to its fatigue and sacrifice.

The key to living at ease with this aspect is to join both Sun and Pluto by taking the information that instinct, symbolized by Pluto, provides about other people and processing it with generosity and empathy in the personality symbolized by the Sun, so that the person comes to know other people as akin to the self. By being conscious of the likeness of other people to the self, the person ultimately comes to find inner value and acceptance as all divisions are unified into one.

I have this aspect but don't know how to read transits so iono what times in my life to look back on. Sun aquarius square pluto in scorpio. Forsure had many dealings with depression, def have hard times reading vibes from people and understanding them when I'm busy worrying about everything I do.

masterbuilder I have a bucket chart with jupiter as my handle how is that for getting involved? :]

astrology02 said:

I was just wondering if anyone who has this aspect could explain it better? I would really appreciate it

-it causes depression, anxiety,
-can cause a person to attract challenging situations to their lives
-is a difficult aspect to handle
- has to do with internal energies

Click to expand...

Hello.
Sun square Pluto it's an interesting aspect in my opinion...
Pluto is also about Death & Rebirth... And it 'kills' the ego of sun...
So I believe that the depression, the anxiety, and all things you say are correct until one point of the life... The pluto says 'enough with this!' And a total transformation comes to life. I think people with this aspect may be in a constant transformation of self, in order to get stronger and stronger.
The first example that now came to my mind is Demi Lovato. She is an actress and singer and had a HUGE depression... I think during one year she had to be in a lot of medical hospitals... However, It looks like things are now better for her and when I saw her in tv for the last time i didn't want to believe it was her. A TOTAL TRANSFORMATION...
Well, that is very representative of sun-pluto aspects...

Fragoso

I have the other hard aspect: Sun opposite Pluto. The only thing I remember about it is that people or love or hate me. But my destiny has to do with this aspect, because I have my sun conjunct north node in ninth house and Pluto conjunct South Node in third house. Still didn't figured out what this could mean, even not if I read about it and look back into my life.

What more can one ask for than Sun square Pluto after a stressful workday!
You have all hit it right on its centerpiece. This aspect is very much influenced by the signs and houses in which it resides. Its manifestation is thus different and similar for each person. A Sun Aquarius square Pluto in Scorpio, like you Powerion and similarly Lightrider, has lessons in learning how to be independent without sacrificing relationships with others. The square is powerful because of the paradoxes and conundrums that it provides. We become independent by being dependent on those and that which keeps us alive, food from the Earth, water from the sky, and the solace of contact with other life that reassures us of the life inside of us.
So, learning how to relate to and talk to others to elicit the information that will allow us to perceive them is a lesson, even with Sun conjunct North Node in the ninth house and Pluto conjunct South Node in the third house as with you, Fullmoonlibra. When Pluto conjuncts the South Node in the third house, it is about changing communication that starts from a place where it is casual and on the surface, because so much of it is detail, and bringing it to North Node in the ninth house where the self communicates deeply with intellectual and spiritual ideas that are at home in the ninth house. Sun opposite Pluto in this case is about getting to the heart of matters and bringing it out for people to hear and see, so you come to know yourself.
And, isn't coming to know ourselves all about transformation, Fragoso. Sun square Pluto transforms but in a paradoxical way. It challenges one to make up for the parts that are lacking, so we become balanced and unified as one in spirit. For an overbearing and egotistical self, the challenge is compassion and self-modesty as survival depends on them and for a servile and sacrificing self, the challenge is assertiveness and self-resurrection as survival depends on them. Thus, deficits are filled and surpluses are cut till all is balanced and whole.
Sun square Pluto is no different from man-made versus natural. The Sun is man in construction and design, whereas Pluto is nature in presence and pureness. The square reconciles the two, so existence can continue.
And may it continue into a Happy New Year for all of you.

I have this aspect (PLUTO/ Libra/ House11 square SUN/ Capricorn/ House2).

From what I've read in this thread so far, there are many aspects I identify with. Depression and self-destructive behavior are indeed some of them. But also identify greatly with some of what PlutonicAnna said.

PlutonicAnna said:

I feel that the 'Pluto squaring my Sun-aspect' makes me a creative person. I have a strong need to create. That also means creating my own life
I love to transform my self conscience.

People who don't know me well, think sometimes that I am lighthearted and cheerful (my Saggiturius-Sun), but I have a dark side, that likes intimidating men.

Click to expand...

Since this aspect is happening between Houses 11 and 2 in my chart, I am inclined to think that the way I behave in society versus who I am behind closed doors or in more anonymous situations is directly affected. There is much discomfort in my dealings in work situations and I conscientiously make the effort to put on a happy face, that is when I want to get along. This seems to happen only at work where I consistently feel I must prove myself to others and no matter how ****** the job is, I'll give 120% with a smile on my face.
When someone recognizes me outside of work this creates a rather awkward and again discomforting situation for me as I am much more introverted and somber outside of work.

To add to what has already been shared in this thread, here is what astro.com says about it:
"Sun Square Pluto *
You must learn to be very careful how you deal with others, especially people in positions of authority. You tend to get involved in personality conflicts in which you have to prove your strength or suffer defeat. These conflicts often arise without your understanding how they came about. Others often misunderstand your actions, which puts them on their guard.
As you get older, you will probably be quite ambitious, and you will work very hard to get ahead. Do not expect to have an easy time, however. Others will continually force you to prove that you are good at what you do. If you can keep trying against all odds, you will probably achieve quite a bit in life."

Something I personally translated from a chart reading done for me on a French site also about this aspect:
"With you, there is two sides to the medal. We would be wrong to think we know you, the image you project is not necessarily who you are deep inside: when you appear to conform to the norms presented to you, in reality, you believe that the social values attributed to them are rather useless. With your rebellious streak deep inside, you feel estranged from the world and its laws. When in contrast, you allow that part of you to show through, you stand firm on your beliefs and act accordingly. This can create confusion in who you feel you really are, or where you feel you belong.
Maybe you already belong in some type of marginal group, a universe apart from conventions with other sets of values. Or perhaps you appear to live conformally with what others expect but preserve a secret garden outside all norms, a relationship that no one expects, a passion for the unconventional.
Your behavior may seem paradoxical when you appear in accordance with something but later reverse your stand to refusal, or from implication to taking your distance."

Hi everybody I have already read all you've written about this aspect but I would like to get some information from TransformingSelf about some aspects, very hard ones for me:

Sun in leo, X house
Pluto in scorpio, I house
sun squares pluto

and then

Moon in taurus, VII house

moon squares sun
moon in opposition to pluto

Somebody told me it's a T-Apex with the sun at the top. The sun is in its domicile, and same for pluto and the moon is in exaltation.

I can tell you I can't understand my emotions which are really strong and intense, I always destroy my believes and securities because I always undermine everything I know about myself and everything I feel with the opposite thoughts or emotions. It's like I don't know what is true or not.
Sometimes I feel like on a boat floating in the middle of an ocean, without directions and whitout knowing who I am.

Is there something to learn from those aspects? Something to help develop them in a good way?

This article interest me because I have sun contra parallel my pluto an my moon conjunct my pluto

theV said:

This article interest me because I have sun contra parallel my pluto an my moon conjunct my pluto

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Yes it should. I don't have any contra-parallels but I do have a number of parallels and I find them to be deeper and more instinctive than conjunctions.

I'd recommend reading all you can about sun opposite pluto then sifting through it with your own personal experiences.

Parallels and Contras are definitely similar to conjunctions and oppositions but not the same.

There's an excellent explanation of Pars and Contras on this site. If you search for "parallels" I'm sure you'll find it.