MissScorpio
Well-known member
...............
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Moon VOC
- Thread starter MissScorpio
- Start date
Larxene
Well-known member
I don't have the time to find the quotes, but in Mathesis by Firmicus Maternus, he had several chapters devoted to the applications and separations of the Moon. This includes the case where the Moon is "void of course", not applying nor separating from any planet, according to one definition. I believe you can find this in Book IV. Generally, it is a negative indicator, according to Maternus. But he dealt with natal astrology, so I cannot say anything about horary or the other branches.
Larxene Xenohart
Larxene Xenohart
Larxene
Well-known member
I found it. It can be found here:
(a) Bram translation, Book IV, Chapter VIII, p. 123
(b) Holden translation, Book IV, Chapter 3, p. 185-186
A short excerpt:
"1. But if the Moon is so posited that she moves towards none [of the stars], and she does not conjoin herself to any star by her own aspect, and if a benefic star does not sit upon [any of] the angles, it will make disheartened, poor persons, and those who are lacking all the necessities, and those to whom the supports of daily life are dennied, and who always desire the support of strangers for sustaining their life, and who support the want of poverty with a wretched beggary. Moreover, they will be entirely inferior to their parents; and in fact their bodies will be weak, listless and worn out with a persistent leanness. They will be attacked by malign humors, and they are worn down by the continual swelling of wounds..."
- Holden translation, p. 185
Also, regarding your question of whether it is the same for everyone, having a void of course Moon in one's natal chart would probably show inactivity and lack in everyone's chart. But all things are not equal. There may be mitigating factors (read the whole passage from Maternus to find out some of the mitigating factors) present in one chart but absent in another. Also, the area of life where the inactivity and lack manifests will be different depending on where Cancer and some of the other signs related to the Moon fall: which house they are in, and whether there are Lots inside these signs.
Hope this helped,
Larxene Xenohart
(a) Bram translation, Book IV, Chapter VIII, p. 123
(b) Holden translation, Book IV, Chapter 3, p. 185-186
A short excerpt:
"1. But if the Moon is so posited that she moves towards none [of the stars], and she does not conjoin herself to any star by her own aspect, and if a benefic star does not sit upon [any of] the angles, it will make disheartened, poor persons, and those who are lacking all the necessities, and those to whom the supports of daily life are dennied, and who always desire the support of strangers for sustaining their life, and who support the want of poverty with a wretched beggary. Moreover, they will be entirely inferior to their parents; and in fact their bodies will be weak, listless and worn out with a persistent leanness. They will be attacked by malign humors, and they are worn down by the continual swelling of wounds..."
- Holden translation, p. 185
Also, regarding your question of whether it is the same for everyone, having a void of course Moon in one's natal chart would probably show inactivity and lack in everyone's chart. But all things are not equal. There may be mitigating factors (read the whole passage from Maternus to find out some of the mitigating factors) present in one chart but absent in another. Also, the area of life where the inactivity and lack manifests will be different depending on where Cancer and some of the other signs related to the Moon fall: which house they are in, and whether there are Lots inside these signs.
Hope this helped,
Larxene Xenohart
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MissScorpio
Well-known member
Thanks guys, very helpful. 
MissScorpio
Well-known member
Larxene, where can I get this book from?
Also, what I meant was.. Saturday Moon was squaring Sun, I had a terrible day.. Yet the Moon in Virgo was actually sextile my Natal Sun, conjunct my Mars and a few other planets..
Also, what I meant was.. Saturday Moon was squaring Sun, I had a terrible day.. Yet the Moon in Virgo was actually sextile my Natal Sun, conjunct my Mars and a few other planets..
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
available on amazon http://www.amazon.co.uk/Ancient-Astrology-Theory-Practice-Matheseos/dp/1933303107
'....Julius Firmicus Maternus, a native of Sicily and a Roman lawyer of the senatorial class
who lived in first half of fourth century AD (c.280-c.360).
He was also a student of Greek astrology, which forms the basis of this book.
Of this book, James Herschel Holden writes
"The Mathesis is the lengthiest astrological treatise that has come down to us from the classical period.
It consists of eight books, of which the first forms an introductory essay on astrology,
and the rest set forth the fundamentals of Greek astrology.
Several sections contain material that is found nowhere else...." (History of Horoscopic Astrology, pg. 66.)...'
QUOTE
'....Firmicus seemed worthy of note for many reasons.
He is almost alone as author of works produced both before and after an apparent conversion to Christianity....
He left a lengthy handbook detailing the astrological practices of his day,
the only work which has come down to us in its entirety [90% complete: Holden]
out of numerous astrological treatises written in the Hellenistic and Roman periods.....
This manual was important because it was the channel for astrological lore to the Middle Ages and Renaissance."
(from the Preface)
Jean Rhys Bram holds a degree in Latin from the University of Chicago,
and a Ph.D. in Classics from New York University.
She taught Latin, ancient Greek, and Mythology at Hunter College until her retirement.
At 92, she continues to read widely and tutor students....'
Larxene
Well-known member
There are two translations of this work, and they are usually available in all major bookstores, both bricks-and-mortar and online bookstores. Among the online bookstores that sell it are Amazon and Book Depository.
I would recommend that you get the Holden translation if you can afford it, as his translation is more complete and faithful to the chapter sequences in the manuscripts than Bram's. It's about 2-3x the price of Bram's translation, and is available in either paperback or hardback.
Also, regarding what you were saying about transits, first of all, that would mean that the Moon isn't void of course, unless you mean it was aspecting by sign, and not by degrees.
Secondly, I would look at the major time lords before deciding why something happened the way it did. This depends on which time lord system you use. I prefer to use Zodiacal Releasing, as I have found it to be eeriely accurate in timing many matters. Another reason is because Valens gave some details with regards to how to use it, so I do not have to reinvent the wheel, so to speak. In this regard, it is better than Decennials, as the latter technique never received much elaboration from the Hellenistic authors I've read. Time lords are hierarchical; it is better to apply a top-down approach, from the most general time lord to the most specific. Transits are not even time lords, they simply reflect planetary cycles. Thus, they are at the lowest level.
Currently, my preferred methods are Zodiacal Releasing (L1-L4) > Transits. Some people may prefer to slip Annual Profections and/or Solar Revolutions in between. Another hierarchy, which is perhaps more commonly used by Arabic/Medieval/Renaissance astrologers is Primary Directions > Solar Revolutions/Annual Profections > Transits. I have yet to see a Firdaria/Decennials based hierarchy, but that may be possible too.
(Please note that ZR is a technique in which we start from a sign that contains either Fortune or Spirit, and then gives the sign rulership over a period of time. After that, the next sign in zodiacal order takes over, and so on. For example, Fortune in Taurus, Taurus will rule over the first period of time, then Gemini, then Cancer, and so on.)
Let me give a brief example using ZR and Transits. Someone I know had a period in which his ZR Level 1 and Level 2 Lords were in detriment. This shows the general times to be mixed, both good and bad. Now, his Level 3 Lord is a sign ruled by Mars, and this is the 12th sign from the natal Ascendant, signifying sickness and injuries. Furthermore, the natal Lot of Fortune is in this sign. This indicates some problems with regards to the body. The Level 4 period belonged to the 10th sign from the L3 sign, at that time.
Now get this: in the natal chart, Mars is in this 10th sign from L3. If I remember correctly, this is called "the encounter of the domicile lord". This is where the significations signified by L3 manifests, which is bodily sickness. The fact that natal Mars is in square to the natal Lot of Fortune reinforces this reading.
Now that we know what ZR indicates, let's look at the transits. Where was Mars? Turns out, it was in the 10th sign from L3 as well! The L2 Lord was transiting the natal 8th place, an idle place also associated with sickness. Where was the L1 Lord? It was in the L3 sign, the natal 12th place, again signifying sickness.
Everything agrees with each other. What happened? The native had elevated blood pressure, chest pain, and was still afflicted by flu after the 4th day of its inception. The native is in his 20s, however. His health problems were not due to aging. His family had almost no history of elevated blood pressure, and no history of chest pain. Something else must have sparked it.
The point is, transits only allow the activated time lords to deliver what they promised in the natal chart. If the transits looks threatening, but the transiting planet has little power over the times, then whatever manifests is milder.
That concludes my long-winded answer.
Hope this helped,
Larxene Xenohart
I would recommend that you get the Holden translation if you can afford it, as his translation is more complete and faithful to the chapter sequences in the manuscripts than Bram's. It's about 2-3x the price of Bram's translation, and is available in either paperback or hardback.
Also, regarding what you were saying about transits, first of all, that would mean that the Moon isn't void of course, unless you mean it was aspecting by sign, and not by degrees.
Secondly, I would look at the major time lords before deciding why something happened the way it did. This depends on which time lord system you use. I prefer to use Zodiacal Releasing, as I have found it to be eeriely accurate in timing many matters. Another reason is because Valens gave some details with regards to how to use it, so I do not have to reinvent the wheel, so to speak. In this regard, it is better than Decennials, as the latter technique never received much elaboration from the Hellenistic authors I've read. Time lords are hierarchical; it is better to apply a top-down approach, from the most general time lord to the most specific. Transits are not even time lords, they simply reflect planetary cycles. Thus, they are at the lowest level.
Currently, my preferred methods are Zodiacal Releasing (L1-L4) > Transits. Some people may prefer to slip Annual Profections and/or Solar Revolutions in between. Another hierarchy, which is perhaps more commonly used by Arabic/Medieval/Renaissance astrologers is Primary Directions > Solar Revolutions/Annual Profections > Transits. I have yet to see a Firdaria/Decennials based hierarchy, but that may be possible too.
(Please note that ZR is a technique in which we start from a sign that contains either Fortune or Spirit, and then gives the sign rulership over a period of time. After that, the next sign in zodiacal order takes over, and so on. For example, Fortune in Taurus, Taurus will rule over the first period of time, then Gemini, then Cancer, and so on.)
Let me give a brief example using ZR and Transits. Someone I know had a period in which his ZR Level 1 and Level 2 Lords were in detriment. This shows the general times to be mixed, both good and bad. Now, his Level 3 Lord is a sign ruled by Mars, and this is the 12th sign from the natal Ascendant, signifying sickness and injuries. Furthermore, the natal Lot of Fortune is in this sign. This indicates some problems with regards to the body. The Level 4 period belonged to the 10th sign from the L3 sign, at that time.
Now get this: in the natal chart, Mars is in this 10th sign from L3. If I remember correctly, this is called "the encounter of the domicile lord". This is where the significations signified by L3 manifests, which is bodily sickness. The fact that natal Mars is in square to the natal Lot of Fortune reinforces this reading.
Now that we know what ZR indicates, let's look at the transits. Where was Mars? Turns out, it was in the 10th sign from L3 as well! The L2 Lord was transiting the natal 8th place, an idle place also associated with sickness. Where was the L1 Lord? It was in the L3 sign, the natal 12th place, again signifying sickness.
Everything agrees with each other. What happened? The native had elevated blood pressure, chest pain, and was still afflicted by flu after the 4th day of its inception. The native is in his 20s, however. His health problems were not due to aging. His family had almost no history of elevated blood pressure, and no history of chest pain. Something else must have sparked it.
The point is, transits only allow the activated time lords to deliver what they promised in the natal chart. If the transits looks threatening, but the transiting planet has little power over the times, then whatever manifests is milder.
That concludes my long-winded answer.
Hope this helped,
Larxene Xenohart
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MissScorpio
Well-known member
WOW I have never heard of ZR technique, how can I learn more? I want to look at for my own curiosity of what happened on Saturday.
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
Zodiacal Releasing is an Hellenistic astrological technique or method
illustrated by VETTIUS VALENS two thousand year old text 'THE ANTHOLOGY'
a FREE TRANSLATION of THE ANTHOLOGY by VETTIUS VALENS from the original Ancient Greek is available online
translated by Professor Riley http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/Vettius Valens entire.pdf
Robert Schmidt of Project Hindsight has also translated VETTIUS VALENS
CURTIS MANWARING has worked closely for years with Robert Schmidt
and created software that calculates Zodiacal Releasing
Curtis Manwaring article Zodiacal Releasing (Aphesis) and Planetary Period Chronocrators http://www.astrology-x-files.com/x-files/zodiacal-aphesis.html
INFORMATIVE ARTICLE
Zodiacal Releasing from Spirit: The Tsunami Effect in The Life of John Kerry by Ellen Loehr Black
http://www.projecthindsight.com/articles/Zodiacal Releasing - John Kerry.pdf
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
Curtis Manwaring software program DELPHIC ORACLE calculates ZR http://www.astrology-x-files.com/
Curtis Manwaring also developed a freeware aphesis program https://archive.org/details/tucows_285560_Zodiacal_Aphesis
however this older program has issues which quote:
QUOTE
'....It has to do with the UTC time changes
that unless you're doing time zone lookups for the location,
the times will be an hour off for approximately 6 months out of the year.
This is why it is best to use UTC (which I do in Delphic Oracle)
unless you want to bog down the calculation with iterations of zone lookups......' Curtis Manwaring
_________________
Curtis Manwaring also developed a freeware aphesis program https://archive.org/details/tucows_285560_Zodiacal_Aphesis
however this older program has issues which quote:
QUOTE
'....It has to do with the UTC time changes
that unless you're doing time zone lookups for the location,
the times will be an hour off for approximately 6 months out of the year.
This is why it is best to use UTC (which I do in Delphic Oracle)
unless you want to bog down the calculation with iterations of zone lookups......' Curtis Manwaring
_________________
Larxene
Well-known member
Hello Ms. Scorpio,
Also note that I have not read Valens' instructions on how to use ZR. I have only read Curtis' tips in his free software Aphesis. The interpretations are based on my current overall understanding of Hellenistic techniques. However, his Book IV will be invaluable for determining how to use the technique as it was intended by Valens.
I also recommend that you get the Aphesis software and read the "Contents" file written by Curtis, that will be a good starting point.
Regards,
Larxene Xenohart
Also note that I have not read Valens' instructions on how to use ZR. I have only read Curtis' tips in his free software Aphesis. The interpretations are based on my current overall understanding of Hellenistic techniques. However, his Book IV will be invaluable for determining how to use the technique as it was intended by Valens.
I also recommend that you get the Aphesis software and read the "Contents" file written by Curtis, that will be a good starting point.
Regards,
Larxene Xenohart