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Old 02-11-2010, 03:40 AM
HeyPlayGirl HeyPlayGirl is offline
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*18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

hi guys,
ok so i have a relative who has a history of mental illness and drug use and i just found out that not long after i recently talked to him he committed a violent sexual act against his mother (i won't say the word just to keep things censored i guess?? although im not sure how to censor something like this) while holding a weapon and then he ended up hanging himself sunday.

ok i immediately wanted to see his chart! i am very interested in forensic/criminal astrology (it's the scorpio in me i guess)
i looked up vital records and stuff but couldnt find a birth time. i do have his chart without a birth time though and the transits for the dates he committed both these acts yet i don't see anything?? am i missing a grand square or something?
he supposedly died around 6:40 pm on feb 7th but wasn't pronounced dead at the hospital until 7:30. at 6:40 the moon was at 12 degrees sag (astro.com wont let me put an exact time just a date) so would that have made a grand square with his natal saturn/sun/jupiter t square?

i was surprised at the easy aspects in his brith chart too. i mean at the least i thought i'd see a mars opp pluto or mars trine saturn or something...his sun is opposite saturn which sounds uncomfortable though.

as for the mental illness, coudl it maybe be his mercury conjunct pluto&uranus and opp chiron? the orbs are wide though.
i don't know, i guess i thought it would be more obvious even without a birthtime. maybe it would have all been explained through progressions and solar arcs.

if anyoen is bored and wants to add some 2 cents for the heck of it i'd appreciate it. the first chart is the day he committed the crime and the 2nd is for the day he died.
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Last edited by HeyPlayGirl; 02-11-2010 at 04:21 AM.
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Old 02-11-2010, 08:59 AM
EJ53 EJ53 is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

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Originally Posted by HeyPlayGirl View Post
...as for the mental illness, coudl it maybe be his mercury conjunct pluto&uranus and opp chiron?
NMercury opposite NChiron, with NMoon trine former/sextile latter and all influenced by NPluto/NUranus/NNeptune/NMars......[The Moon/Mother is the outlet through which he could release the other planetary energies].

Then, on the day of the crime, this configuration and strong sexual urges were activated by TSun/TVenus in Capricorn (control) and TMars in Leo (personal power).
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Old 02-11-2010, 09:59 AM
Shining Ray Shining Ray is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

I had a look at his transits for this time, and here are my thoughts:

Transiting Jupiter opposite Saturn can show hard luck, and a pessimistic outlook on the future (in suicide studies the aspect occurs frequently). Transiting Neptune opposite his natal Sun shows heightened sensitivity to his Sun profile. There was a lot of confusion around his identity during both of these tragedies. I thought he was younger until I looked at his chart. I am shocked to read this has happened and the whole family must be devastated. The Neptuinan guilt would have been prominent too, his means of redemption () or escaping responsibility for his crime is suicide, it was a period in time that he was entering a fog and loss clarity, uncertain about the future.

The Sun-Saturn natally represents inferiority problems, authority issues, and absent father, feelings of never being good enough. Some background on the mother-son relationship would be extremely helpful. Who knows the reality of the relationship. Escapism is powerful, at this time, the Neptune transit is exact and Neptune longs to go back home (spirit ) some people take drugs and alcohol around Neptune times as a means of escape. Transiting squared , and I did see this transit in the chart of a woman who committed suicide live on air; she was under the same configuration. The transit is tight and can represent large disillusionment of some kind, some fantasy hitting reality (), self-martyring.

The t-square of Sun-Jupiter-Saturn is triggered; his self image can go up and down, feeling like a god and back down to reality. His Venus-Mars (love, affection, sex, drive) conjunction in (mother) is squared by (abuse, threaten, secrets, take by force). I always advocate looking at a transiting picture the way a natal horoscope is formed. Use the orbs you would use for natal aspects. Here is a list of aspects for 7th February 2010. Everyone always looks at Pluto for rape; in mythology Jupiter raped numerous women. Pluto can apply for abduction into the underworld, and rape with involved in transit/natally has often occurred. This is such a sad tragedy and hopefully the family can heal from this horrific trauma.
  • Transiting Opposite (separating 8 degrees)
  • Transiting trine (applying 5 degrees)
  • Transiting conjunct (separating 2 degrees)
  • Transiting opposite (applying 4 degrees)
  • Transiting opposite (applying 8 degrees)
  • Transiting square (applying 6 degrees)
  • Transiting opposite (separating 6 degrees)
  • Transiting opposite (separating 0 degrees)
  • Transiting square (separating 0 degrees)
  • Transiting conjunct (applying 6 degrees)
  • Transiting opposite (applying 6 degrees)
  • Transiting opposite (applying 8 degrees)

Last edited by Shining Ray; 02-11-2010 at 10:23 AM.
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Old 02-11-2010, 05:56 PM
milkywaygirl milkywaygirl is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

as shining pointed out, venus/mars conjunct in cancer, sextile pluto.. to me says a lot about what turns this person on. sorry by the way, its a terrible thing to happen! i have met several people with venus/mars conjunctions and what they all have in common is the idea of violence/dominance/aggression deeply intertwined with their desires. its hard for these natives to separate the two.

dont have much to add except a little aside: i was really bored one day and went through the american sex offenders database collecting dobs of known violent sexual offenders, and i apart from a lot of mars/saturn mars/pluto interactions, i noticed a lot of mars in cancer. mars in cancer is tricky, i find it to be a really deceptive and sneaky placement, very not into direct confrontation, as well its in the fall in cancer, so the martian energy can easily end up going the wrong way if badly aspected. i only know only one person with mars in cancer and he can be downright nasty when he gets worked up, really goes for the jugular and just doesnt let up. when actions/mars are controlled by emotions/moon, and the emotions arent sitting well, it makes for a potentially very negative outcome.
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Old 02-11-2010, 06:55 PM
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

So EJ53 and Shining Ray, are you suggesting that you could have predicted the death in advance, using your methods of analysis?
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Old 02-11-2010, 07:13 PM
Shining Ray Shining Ray is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

No, I don't think either of us implied this. It's quite clear the details have been given, I was just shedding light on the transits involved in this tragic event. It's one of those events that couldn't be dreamed up in your worst nightmares. The symbolism is quite striking for what has occurred. Anyone born the same day will have the same transits. If we had not known the events, the Cancer part would have been changed to nurturing and protecting energies. I wouldn't have singled out mother specifically. All the rest applies to the reading even if unknown, you can scribble out the parts about the specific events, if you want, it won't change the reading dramatically. I never predicted his death or E.J, we are objective observers of the event. I am not sure why you believe we are predicting death?
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Old 02-11-2010, 07:26 PM
Shining Ray Shining Ray is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

Quote:
Originally Posted by milkywaygirl View Post
as shining pointed out, venus/mars conjunct in cancer, sextile pluto.. to me says a lot about what turns this person on. sorry by the way, its a terrible thing to happen! i have met several people with venus/mars conjunctions and what they all have in common is the idea of violence/dominance/aggression deeply intertwined with their desires. its hard for these natives to separate the two.

dont have much to add except a little aside: i was really bored one day and went through the american sex offenders database collecting dobs of known violent sexual offenders, and i apart from a lot of mars/saturn mars/pluto interactions, i noticed a lot of mars in cancer. mars in cancer is tricky, i find it to be a really deceptive and sneaky placement, very not into direct confrontation, as well its in the fall in cancer, so the martian energy can easily end up going the wrong way if badly aspected. i only know only one person with mars in cancer and he can be downright nasty when he gets worked up, really goes for the jugular and just doesnt let up. when actions/mars are controlled by emotions/moon, and the emotions arent sitting well, it makes for a potentially very negative outcome.
Hi Milkyway,

I have looked at these type of charts before, and I noticed a Mars in Cancer individual who specifically attacked the breasts in his female victims (cutting them off). It involved Uranus too. I have seen anger directed towards the maternal image in the female, with Moon-Mars or Mars in Cancer.
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Old 02-11-2010, 09:51 PM
milkywaygirl milkywaygirl is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

shining yes definitely - the mars cancer i know hates his mother with a vengeance.
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Old 02-11-2010, 10:14 PM
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

Hey, Shining--I am just fresh from Backy's thread about death prediction, a pet peeve of mine. However, I didn't actually write I "believe [you] are predicting death." I merely hope for more thinking-through of the issues that this thread raises.

Rather than writing "suggesting" I should have asked whether your posts imply that this man's violence against his mother and death through suicide could be predicted.

This is an important question.

For the case of someone who was "a suicide" is there something in the chart that makes this plausible, probable, or inevitable? If so, which is it? (Jupiter opp. Saturn?) and how does one tell the difference without a narrative of events? Obviously death from suicide is 100%, whereas suicidal thoughts and tendencies are not.

Also, while I believe that death charts oftentimes show significant transits, these are apt to be different for different individuals.

In the case of a murder, a soldier who kills someone in the line of duty, or a suicide [a self-murder] presumably something should show up in the chart of the perpetrator, which is what you are discussing. If this can be predicted, a lot of probation officers and courts would like to know about it.

Just to add my 2c to this thread. I learned a lot about Venus/Mars and Cancer from this thread. Thanks very much--I will look out for it in the future.

In addition to his afflicted Moon/Venus/Mars, however, this man also has Saturn opposite Sun: a problem with both of the father planets, and an aspect that generally confers self-esteem issues.

In terms of mental illness, I think Uranus/Mercury is often implicated: here we see Pluto on their midpoint opposed by Saturn. I wonder if Dad (Saturn in Pisces) was an alcoholic, drug user, or abuser of his son.

In terms of transits, the moon is often a trigger-point, passing over the Neptune apex of this man's kite formation. Transiting Lilith squared his natal Venus exactly in the first chart. By the 2nd chart she's finished with his Mars and Pluto, and trined his Neptune.
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Old 02-11-2010, 10:26 PM
HeyPlayGirl HeyPlayGirl is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

ok im gonna reply to everyones comments soon but im suuuuper busy right now! brb
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Old 02-12-2010, 12:31 AM
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

hi waybread,
i dont know if i'm understanding your point of view or not. are you saying that violent acts can not be predicted with the info of the criminal but you can with the victim's info? or you don't believe in predicitve astrology at all?
in any case, can we see the violent act this man committed and his death for 100% certainty in his natal/transits especially without a birthtime? probably not. BUT what is a pet peeve to you, is an area of interest for many others. if it makes you feel better i'll add a warning-JUST BECAUSE ONE CHART& IT'S TRANSITS MAY SHOW THE POSSIBILITY OF VIOLENCE OR DEATH DOES NOT MEAN YOURE GONNA DIE OR BECOME A PREDATOR TOO IF YOU HAVE THESE ASPECTS IN YOUR CHART/TRANSITS/SOLAR ARCS etc.
also EJ nor shiningray ever actually stated that with those configurations and transits that a crime will indefinitely be committed. they merely showed what may have compelled someone to commit one that day. these are all speculations to think about.

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If this can be predicted, a lot of probation officers and courts would like to know about it.
you're right. and i agree with you that if it is possible, it would most likely be different with every person and probably different with every act of violence also. but this is a discussion forum and this topic has more than one side and opinion. i fully respect that you think it is not possible to see his suicide or sexual assault with the very little information i have provided and you're most likely right,but i still want to discuss it.

instead of me asking "possible to see violence with transits?" i should have asked "if you believe it is possible to see violence in the transits of a criminal then what do you see that stands out during these 2 days violence was committed?" that way i can weed out the people whose answer is "no". basically the odds of us finding a PERFECT answer for this thread is slim to none but the fact that i have (half) a chart of a man who r-ed his own mother, used drugs, has a mental illness, and then hung himself is interesting to some of us that enjoy reading about forensic and criminal astrology. it's a morbid curiosity. so i'm not saying you're wrong but i still think his chart is worth at least taking a look at even if astrology won't show the whole picture.


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In terms of mental illness, I think Uranus/Mercury is often implicated: here we see Pluto on their midpoint opposed by Saturn. I wonder if Dad (Saturn in Pisces) was an alcoholic, drug user, or abuser of his son..
some more backround info- his father&uncles are all mentally ill. i dont know what mental illness he and his family have but i'm thinking maybe a severe form of bipolar. his speech and mannerisms were normal (to me at least) so i doubt he was schizo. he also used drugs off and on. never was arrested for sexual violence though. msot of his arrests were duis and theft.
also his father was mean to his mother but i'm not sure if she was also mean to him or if he was abused but from what ive heard she never did anything to him. his mom is this 65 yr old woman who is like a soft spoken, country bumpkin. no education...kinda slow i guess. he looks disheveled and out of it in his mug shot. probably was on drugs. not sure what led up to the act though. he tried to kill himself a couple of times between the first and 2nd charts so it makes me think maybe he was udner the influence when he did it and then once he 'came to' in the jail he couldnt live with himself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by waybread View Post
In terms of transits, the moon is often a trigger-point, passing over the Neptune apex of this man's kite formation. Transiting Lilith squared his natal Venus exactly in the first chart. By the 2nd chart she's finished with his Mars and Pluto, and trined his Neptune..
thanks for your insight..it's all very scary to think about but intriguing at the same time...

Last edited by HeyPlayGirl; 02-12-2010 at 12:44 AM.
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Old 02-12-2010, 12:48 AM
HeyPlayGirl HeyPlayGirl is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

thanks ej. it's very interesting to me to see how the planets influence us in negative manners. i need to pay more attention to the NN in charts though!

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Originally Posted by EJ53 View Post
NMercury opposite NChiron, with NMoon trine former/sextile latter and all influenced by NPluto/NUranus/NNeptune/NMars......[The Moon/Mother is the outlet through which he could release the other planetary energies].

Then, on the day of the crime, this configuration and strong sexual urges were activated by TSun/TVenus in Capricorn (control) and TMars in Leo (personal power).
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Old 02-12-2010, 01:06 AM
HeyPlayGirl HeyPlayGirl is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

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Originally Posted by Shining Ray View Post
Transiting Jupiter opposite Saturn can show hard luck, and a pessimistic outlook on the future (in suicide studies the aspect occurs frequently). Transiting Neptune opposite his natal Sun shows heightened sensitivity to his Sun profile. There was a lot of confusion around his identity during both of these tragedies. I thought he was younger until I looked at his chart. I am shocked to read this has happened and the whole family must be devastated. The Neptuinan guilt would have been prominent too, his means of redemption () or escaping responsibility for his crime is suicide, it was a period in time that he was entering a fog and loss clarity, uncertain about the future.
wow shining that is interesting and thanks for taking a look.
actually could the neptune confusion&heightened sensitivity instead have been drugs? i know neptune can represent being under the influence also. i dont know for certain he was on drugs at the tiem of the crime but it is a possiblity. he was sober when he committed suicide though so the neptunian guilt fits perfectly with that.

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Originally Posted by Shining Ray View Post
The Sun-Saturn natally represents inferiority problems, authority issues, and absent father, feelings of never being good enough. Some background on the mother-son relationship would be extremely helpful. Who knows the reality of the relationship. Escapism is powerful, at this time, the Neptune transit is exact and Neptune longs to go back home (spirit ) some people take drugs and alcohol around Neptune times as a means of escape. Transiting squared , and I did see this transit in the chart of a woman who committed suicide live on air; she was under the same configuration. The transit is tight and can represent large disillusionment of some kind, some fantasy hitting reality (), self-martyring.
from what i know his father was mentally ill as well. no drugs or abuse from either parent althoug the father was verbally abusive to the mother. who knows for sure though. wow this is all so informative.

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Originally Posted by Shining Ray View Post
The t-square of Sun-Jupiter-Saturn is triggered; his self image can go up and down, feeling like a god and back down to reality. His Venus-Mars (love, affection, sex, drive) conjunction in (mother) is squared by (abuse, threaten, secrets, take by force). I always advocate looking at a transiting picture the way a natal horoscope is formed. Use the orbs you would use for natal aspects. Here is a list of aspects for 7th February 2010. Everyone always looks at Pluto for rape; in mythology Jupiter raped numerous women. Pluto can apply for abduction into the underworld, and rape with involved in transit/natally has often occurred.
thanks shining!!! that was all VERY informative and interesting!! i'm gonna continue studying his information and as well as his immediate familys' charts probably for years. i hope i can find a birthtime for him eventually.
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Old 02-12-2010, 01:09 AM
HeyPlayGirl HeyPlayGirl is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

hey milkyway, thanks for adding.
i do that too!! haha kinda funny.
but anyway, those are aspects i will look out for when i study other sex offender charts. it's so intriguing to me. maybe i should get into astro psychology
Quote:
Originally Posted by milkywaygirl View Post
as shining pointed out, venus/mars conjunct in cancer, sextile pluto.. to me says a lot about what turns this person on. sorry by the way, its a terrible thing to happen! i have met several people with venus/mars conjunctions and what they all have in common is the idea of violence/dominance/aggression deeply intertwined with their desires. its hard for these natives to separate the two.

dont have much to add except a little aside: i was really bored one day and went through the american sex offenders database collecting dobs of known violent sexual offenders, and i apart from a lot of mars/saturn mars/pluto interactions, i noticed a lot of mars in cancer. mars in cancer is tricky, i find it to be a really deceptive and sneaky placement, very not into direct confrontation, as well its in the fall in cancer, so the martian energy can easily end up going the wrong way if badly aspected. i only know only one person with mars in cancer and he can be downright nasty when he gets worked up, really goes for the jugular and just doesnt let up. when actions/mars are controlled by emotions/moon, and the emotions arent sitting well, it makes for a potentially very negative outcome.
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Old 02-13-2010, 06:54 AM
HeyPlayGirl HeyPlayGirl is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

oh good observation, tora!
and i just recently started reading about fixed stars so i'll more into it, thanks!
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Old 02-13-2010, 09:33 AM
Shining Ray Shining Ray is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

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Hey, Shining--I am just fresh from Backy's thread about death prediction, a pet peeve of mine. However, I didn't actually write I "believe [you] are predicting death." I merely hope for more thinking-through of the issues that this thread raises.
I know predicting death is a dicey subject. I have never once tried this in any thread. I look at the transits after death, to see what has occurred.

Quote:
Rather than writing "suggesting" I should have asked whether your posts imply that this man's violence against his mother and death through suicide could be predicted.
No, it couldn't be predicted. I am talking about what you can predict in this thread. To explain further, you could predict there was confusion and aimlessness in his life at the time of suicide (Sun-Neptune). Also great disillusionment (Jupiter-Neptune), and an increasing level of powerful anger issues around in , as transiting Pluto squared natal Mars. An aspect notorious for violence, plus he self-destructed and stung himself in the most scorpionic form. When I had transiting square it did attract a difficult sexual situation. I know this transit is not easy, I am currently working on a chart of a woman who was murdered by her partner, and transiting Pluto is opposite natal Mars. I am not spreading fear of an aspect, many people only experience power-battles at this time, and not such violent (Mars-Pluto) confrontations. And of course, I don't think aspect only brings rape, sexual abuse, or murder. However, it is still a difficult aspect, and one that is not always handled well. It deals with anger and power in all it's ugly forms, and it empowers great transformation. The potential for both is there, I don't know what the outcome will be.

Quote:
For the case of someone who was "a suicide" is there something in the chart that makes this plausible, probable, or inevitable? If so, which is it? (Jupiter opp. Saturn?) and how does one tell the difference without a narrative of events? Obviously death from suicide is 100%, whereas suicidal thoughts and tendencies are not.
There has been no such astrological study that can predict suicide is inevitable. There are common aspects to be found, no aspect hammers in any kind of fate to my knowledge. I think we are still meant to have some mystery in our lives.

Quote:
Also, while I believe that death charts oftentimes show significant transits, these are apt to be different for different individuals.

In the case of a murder, a soldier who kills someone in the line of duty, or a suicide [a self-murder] presumably something should show up in the chart of the perpetrator, which is what you are discussing. If this can be predicted, a lot of probation officers and courts would like to know about it.
I am discussing a self murder in this thread, not predicting one. Take the massive deaths around Saturn-Pluto, the Haiti earthquake, under the cardinal square, and the Twin Towers going down under the mutable opposition. As you know, there is much discussion on blogs, forums, websites about what will happen during such a transit. These are predictions, not of the fated kind, but working with the symbolism of possible outcomes. The astrologer will make notes on the potential outcome of a transit. Astrologers use the past as a benchmark for potential future occurrences. The more well versed the astrologer is at symbolism;the better they are at predicting, in my view.

However, they do not say "there will be an earthquake in Haiti, and it will kill thousands of people, it will bring all concrete forms in the city down, and create total destruction(. Haiti will have to be rebuild buildings and other structures (). Read any prediction on Saturn- Pluto and it's not a specific prediction, but does show astrologers prophecies or definitions of the aspect. What I am saying, although no astrologer predicted the Haiti earthquake, they did however, say old concrete forms will be pulled down, destroyed, and we have to rebuild during the transit. The Capricorn energy of the transit also showed us attempting to challenge those in power and authority ( in ), and seek a fairer way of working (). It referred to governments and banks or any other authority. This is how I view prediction, not the specific kind, stating exact events, but the symbolic view of transits. The same symbology is used in predicting individual lives. How would you expect an exact Sun-Neptune aspect to appear, here is one interpretation.

The Pluto Mars approaching, Pluto Venus, and the concerns of this transit focus on Venus in Cancer the transit affects nurturing and security elements, and Mars in Cancer again emotional dependency. The nurturing elements combine with love aggression and power . There is no real skill in predicting, it would not be hard to reach the conclusion that potentially an unpleasant experience of aggression and violence in an emotional relationship may occur. It just happened to be with mother . This is how I use prediction, I could not in a million years predict what actually happened. However, without any one's biased opinion of this story, I have highlighted book interpretations, so that you can view the transits that are particularly striking for sexual aggression in a parental relationship. The books do not know what happened, and are objective . In another individual chart, there is still the potential of domestic abuse, and power-battles in close relationships. Of course it wouldn't manifest in the horrific way it did for this family. However, the symbolism shows potential destructiveness.

Your original question about perpetrators and probation officers is not how I do astrology, personally. I outlined above my approach to transits.

Quote:
And Of course death does always occur under these aspects. Violence does not always occur under Mar-Pluto.
I was attacked under that aspect, and the woman's chart I am studying, was murdered. Of course violence does not always occur, and I never stated this either. I will stand vehemently with the view that frequently shows when violence could potentially occur, or at least powerful emotions would occur, with some powerful reactions.

Last edited by Shining Ray; 02-13-2010 at 10:05 AM.
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Old 02-13-2010, 06:13 PM
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

Thanks, Shining Ray. My question was provocative.

My personal point of view is that death cannot be predicted, nor should it be.

But I realized that this is a different question from whether the moment of homicide or suicide could be predicted--not from the point of view of the victim [which a suicide certainly is--there is a double issue here] but from the chart of the perpetrator: from the chart of someone who commits a violent act.

I don't think the court and probation systems will ever get to the point of asking an astrologer to comment upon good/bad times for a criminal or mentally ill person to be on the loose, but if we feel that a strong propensity for violence occurs at particular times that can be seen in a chart, then maybe they should!

I never looked at Black Moon Lilith much till recently, but now I think that where women are concerned--be it Tiger Woods's infamous incident when his affairs blew up or this horrifying incident that preceded the suicide--that she is often at work.

Interestingly, last night I also looked at the chart of someone who hated his mother. Mars in Cancer conjunct Moon in Cancer facing some stiff opposition. Mars in Cancer afflicted seems like one to watch out for.
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Old 02-13-2010, 08:01 PM
Shining Ray Shining Ray is offline
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Re: *18 and up only*possible to see violence with transits without a birthtime?

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Originally Posted by waybread View Post
Thanks, Shining Ray. My question was provocative.

My personal point of view is that death cannot be predicted, nor should it be.

But I realized that this is a different question from whether the moment of homicide or suicide could be predicted--not from the point of view of the victim [which a suicide certainly is--there is a double issue here] but from the chart of the perpetrator: from the chart of someone who commits a violent act.

I don't think the court and probation systems will ever get to the point of asking an astrologer to comment upon good/bad times for a criminal or mentally ill person to be on the loose, but if we feel that a strong propensity for violence occurs at particular times that can be seen in a chart, then maybe they should!

I never looked at Black Moon Lilith much till recently, but now I think that where women are concerned--be it Tiger Woods's infamous incident when his affairs blew up or this horrifying incident that preceded the suicide--that she is often at work.

Interestingly, last night I also looked at the chart of someone who hated his mother. Mars in Cancer conjunct Moon in Cancer facing some stiff opposition. Mars in Cancer afflicted seems like one to watch out for.
I did a blog post once reenacting a court case using astrology. I had to argue with myself, and bring in top astrologers to fight the case either side. It was fun to do, and it proves astrology should never be used in court, I argued both sides , and I don't know the proper legal terms. I make a ****** defence/prosecuter. The court case is still pending because I couldn't be bothered prosecuting or defending and then deliberating and judging. Its too much for one person to do alone . We should have court cases on here, although it is turning into one. A member faces prosecution every week . In someway debates are very similiar.

I don't advocate predicting death, and I would never do it, and don't know how. My partner has Moon in Leo square Mars, and so he doesn't read this his mother is dramatic, at times. Quiet too, but she likes a a good emotional drama/fight. Sometimes he glances at what I am writing on the computer. He seems to get a long with her, she calls him her favourite son. Many times the aspect can create angry feelings towards mother. My sister has Moon in Aries square Mars in 4th house, has a bad temper. She did have quite a few arguments with my mum.
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