how do you predict death?

franklin taylor

Well-known member
Well, I would not be inclined to think there is any mathematic table or relationship between Lords of house or Planet Rulers that would accurately pinpoint death. How can it? We all to often die from similiar illnesses or in certain situations.

I'd be more inclined to believe Natal Aspects, Planetary placements would give us a tendency to practice unsafe/ bad habits and in the case of Whitney Houston or anyone with Sun squaring Neptune as she has lack an inherent ability to get honest with themselves when they surround themselves with like minded people in her case drug addictions. Her Mercury opposing the ascendant makes for a people pleaser. Early in life a Sun in a weaker house such as a cadent house (6th) like her's can make for a person who's Will may not be strong enough to break out of the people pleaser mold. A less fortunate combination. Any one can laugh all they want when they look at my chart and see I have those two same aspects with my Sun less than a degree squaring Neptune. I promise you that most angular house Sun natives have stronger wills than they appear be they fire signs or other signs placed in the angular house, even if ill aspected or in western hemisphere houses. I never had a drug or alcohol issue. My "drug" of choice was food and it near killed me. I had terminal liver disease for years and I over came by learning my lessons and becoming less rigid and more accepting of alternative medical choices since traditional had no hope at the time. As transiting Saturn came nearer my Natal Sun.. and if you look at Ms. Houston Chart.. She failed to get past the transit only in reverse Transiting Sun (vitality) passed Natal Saturn (lessons in life) an equally dangerous time. She was under double threat because her natal Sun opposing the Saturn transiting Sun aspect was. One can never say any of these aspects indicated WHEN she would die because of this or any particular transit but I would say it is a time of greatest threat from death concerning not learning from any particular life lesson that is not getting through to us. Her stronger square between Venus and Neptune can point to difficult relationships I never had heard she had a drug issue till her and Bobby got together. Incidently, I learned of my serious illness quite a while before another even more critical disease developed that got my attention.. Saturn was near four degrees my natal Sun and also opposing my natal sun less than 4 degrees. Her death being ruled an accident is no surprised when you see she has an unaspected mars which some think such an aspect could equal Sun squaring mars and person with a higher tendency for accidents or recklessness. Even with a part time user of coke it might be reckless to be getting in water much. Further, Saturn in any Classic hard aspect including conjunction to your Natal Sun are critical times in mine and others opinions I have seen it work in my life so many times. They are either a time of final pay off if have been ignoring a situation in your life or in my case they have always been wakeup calls. It may be just myself, but I believe there are not certain aspects of calculations that indicate death exactly and so most are better at looking death in retrospect. Ability to adjust in most every aspect of life is a main key to life. Particularly in our own attitudes about black and white thinking in particular.

Also we are all affected by someone else's whacked out "nervous" and/or "inattentive periods" transits that bring about our death or why are there groups of people dying at once who all have different charts? Only on a personal basis can the Saturn and Sun correlations be at best, vague indicators, of times to be careful or times to readjust our lives. Too many variables. The most visible Solar Eclipse ever to be seen in recorded time here in the central United States is predicted to occur on my birthday (12 August) in 2045...if I and this planet as we know it survives the collision of a particular astroid in the mid 2030s I hope to live to see that eclipse. LOL If not ...whatever ...when you at least have a time of facing your own mortality.. death becomes less important and fearful. I accepted a lot of the ugliness in my life, how I was causing most of it, worked proactively to get through it, went through several of the stages of dealing with death, and then I was given another chance. I inadvertently followed an old adage unknown to me at the time.. "Yield that you may have a victory".
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
I'd be more inclined to believe Natal Aspects, Planetary placements would give us a tendency to practice unsafe/ bad habits and in the case of Whitney Houston or anyone with Sun squaring Neptune as she has lack an inherent ability to get honest with themselves when they surround themselves with like minded people in her case drug addictions. Her Mercury opposing the ascendant makes for a people pleaser. Early in life a Sun in a weaker house such as a cadent house (6th) like her's can make for a person who's Will may not be strong enough to break out of the people pleaser mold. A less fortunate combination.

..... and if you look at Ms. Houston Chart.. She failed to get past the transit only in reverse Transiting Sun (vitality) passed Natal Saturn (lessons in life) an equally dangerous time. She was under double threat because her natal Sun opposing the Saturn transiting Sun aspect was. One can never say any of these aspects indicated WHEN she would die because of this or any particular transit but I would say it is a time of greatest threat from death concerning not learning from any particular life lesson that is not getting through to us. Her stronger square between Venus and Neptune can point to difficult relationships I never had heard she had a drug issue till her and Bobby got together.

Her death being ruled an accident is no surprised when you see she has an unaspected mars which some think such an aspect could equal Sun squaring mars and person with a higher tendency for accidents or recklessness. Even with a part time user of coke it might be reckless to be getting in water much. Further, Saturn in any Classic hard aspect including conjunction to your Natal Sun are critical times in mine and others opinions I have seen it work in my life so many times. They are either a time of final pay off if have been ignoring a situation in your life or in my case they have always been wakeup calls. It may be just myself, but I believe there are not certain aspects of calculations that indicate death exactly and so most are better at looking death in retrospect. Ability to adjust in most every aspect of life is a main key to life. Particularly in our own attitudes about black and white thinking in particular.

QUOTE FROM NEWS REPORTS FRIDAY :smile:


Houston's caused of death explained

Tragic star accidentally drowned; cocaine a contributing factor

Singer Whitney Houston died as a result of accidental drowning, a coroner has ruled.

Cocaine use and heart disease were also named as contributing factors in the star's death. Other drugs found in her blood included marijuana, an anti-anxiety drug, a muscle relaxant and allergy medication.

A spokesman for the coroner said tests showed Houston was a chronic cocaine user, but added that "no trauma or foul play" was suspected in her death.

Houston was found underwater in the bath of her Los Angeles hotel room on February 11.
 

franklin taylor

Well-known member
@ JUPITERASC

QUOTE FROM NEWS REPORTS FRIDAY :smile:


Houston's caused of death explained
Tragic star accidentally drowned; cocaine a contributing factor

Singer Whitney Houston died as a result of accidental drowning, a coroner has ruled.

Cocaine use and heart disease were also named as contributing factors in the star's death. Other drugs found in her blood included marijuana, an anti-anxiety drug, a muscle relaxant and allergy medication.

A spokesman for the coroner said tests showed Houston was a chronic cocaine user, but added that "no trauma or foul play" was suspected in her death.

Houston was found underwater in the bath of her Los Angeles hotel room on February 11

I heard that about an hour ago :tongue:

That so called muscle relaxant medication Flexiril ( generically named cyclobenzaphrine) many people cannot handle it alone. Initially has same effects as the drug Demerol then a tolerance over time brings it to nothing I stopped it because I no longer could not go to sleep with out and no relaxing was occuring with it so I knew that is a bad sign. Needless to say all that other items in her blood. I had extented therapy on it for generalized dystonia for years and it was a horror. It is not actually a muscle relaxant but popularly prescribed as such it is too small dose to relax any muscle group of significance rather it cuts off brain signal sensing full muscle spasming.. Its a "Brain signal suppressant" Too bad about Whitney. She failed to learn transit lessons too long. All that Rehab therapy means nothing if you fail to get honest with yourself and get proactive about change. Never having to face serious life altering consequences of our habits, behaviors is the worst medicine oneself and our society at large as well can go through. Sometimes death is the only life altering consequence for some. When we lie to ourselves so long (Sun square Neptune's native's exaggerated affliction) Saturn lessons are trully symbolic concerning our health and relationship lessons. Her Sun in 6th house accentuates that issue of health.
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
I heard that about an hour ago :tongue:

That so called muscle relaxant medication Flexiril ( generically named cyclobenzaphrine) many people cannot handle it alone. Initially has same effects as the drug Demerol then a tolerance over time brings it to nothing I stopped it because I no longer could not go to sleep with out and no relaxing was occuring with it so I knew that is a bad sign.
Needless to say all that other items in her blood. I had extended therapy on it for generalized dystonia for years and it was a horror. It is not actually a muscle relaxant but popularly prescribed as such it is too small dose to relax any muscle group of significance rather it cuts off brain signal sensing full muscle spasming.. Its a "Brain signal suppressant" Too bad about Whitney. She failed to learn transit lessons too long. All that Rehab therapy means nothing if you fail to get honest with yourself and get proactive about change. Never having to face serious life altering consequences of our habits, behaviors is the worst medicine oneself and our society at large as well can go through. Sometimes death is the only life altering consequence for some. When we lie to ourselves so long (Sun square Neptune's native's exaggerated affliction) Saturn lessons are trully symbolic concerning our health and relationship lessons. Her Sun in 6th house accentuates that issue of health.
It seems that 'Fixing behavior with a magic pill' is widely accepted and it is a matter for serious concern that - due to clever marketing/advertising - many do not question how pills with horrendous side-effects can be of any possible value to anyone other than those who yearly make billions of dollars of profits from their sale! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDlH9sV0lHU&feature=related

A Documentary on Psychiatry
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qs9TLTvYFs&feature=related:smile:
 

dr. farr

Well-known member
an astrologer predict death to someone that isn't already dying,they can try to prevent their death if they know the quality of the influences(dr. farr said that you can know that.) and that could be why there are critical times because if you know the method to find the critical times and the quality of their influences(dr. farr could tell us) you may be able to prevent it.


That is the value (the ONLY value, to my way of thinking) in identifying possible critical periods of life-so that measures can be taken, and certain risks avoided, during that period of time, to strengthen the life force of the individual involved. Other than for such preventive/supportive purposes, longevity estimations and death-period predictions are nothing but vain curiosity; however, retrospective (post mortem) chart investigations are of value, in identifying likely casual astrological trends and indications in the chart, but only as instructional for us, in future evaluations of living persons' charts, for estimating critical periods so that SOMETHING CAN BE DONE to support the individual during those critical periods.
 

retinoid

Well-known member
Franklin Taylor, Cyclobenzaprine is very similar to the tricylic antidepressants where it affects levels of norephinephrine and alters sodium and potassium channels (as well as being a potent anticholinergic. I used to mix a bunch of them with my vodka and sleep for days sometimes when I needed it. They make you very tired. Zzzzz
 
That is the value (the ONLY value, to my way of thinking) in identifying possible critical periods of life-so that measures can be taken, and certain risks avoided, during that period of time, to strengthen the life force of the individual involved. Other than for such preventive/supportive purposes, longevity estimations and death-period predictions are nothing but vain curiosity; however, retrospective (post mortem) chart investigations are of value, in identifying likely casual astrological trends and indications in the chart, but only as instructional for us, in future evaluations of living persons' charts, for estimating critical periods so that SOMETHING CAN BE DONE to support the individual during those critical periods.
what can be done to prevent death during those critical times?
could you tell us what's the method to identify possible critical periods and determine the quality of their influences? thanks
 

Claire19

Well-known member
Death is unpredictable. There are a variety of variables that go into it and you just can't account for them all with something as vague as astrology.

For example, some people have charts that show they should've died in childhood. And this would be 100% true... 500 years ago when we didn't have vaccines for smallpox. Or maybe you'll get shot and die, except the hospital you were sent to has the most advanced trauma center in the world and they manage to perform a miracle and save you. You never know, with all the advances we have it's hard to say how or why someone will die.

Furthermore, as someone stated above, it's immoral for an astrologer to tell you of your time of death. The reason being is similar to an effect researchers observe when they're studying people. The presence of the researcher invariably changes the subject. The same is true for the astrologer; the knowledge of your death changes how you respond to it, leading to a strong possibility the initial outcome was changed.
Whereas astrology is not vague to the experienced and practised, the death influences can be many and varied. I know how I will pass over but not when and do not want to. I have a belief in the afterlife and it does not faze or frighten me. We go when our contract is up but there are times when we can exit during life and for some reason we dont. It is easier in hindsight to see what inflluences were at play. Some things that seem accidental are often not, on the sub conscious level.
 

Claire19

Well-known member
Franklin Taylor, Cyclobenzaprine is very similar to the tricylic antidepressants where it affects levels of norephinephrine and alters sodium and potassium channels (as well as being a potent anticholinergic. I used to mix a bunch of them with my vodka and sleep for days sometimes when I needed it. They make you very tired. Zzzzz
One day you will not wake up and you are lucky that you could afford to zone out for days without everyday responsibilities.
 

dr. farr

Well-known member
what can be done to prevent death during those critical times?
could you tell us what's the method to identify possible critical periods and determine the quality of their influences? thanks


Identify the risks suggested by the astrological indications and then avoid taking those risks; further, those (very few in the West) who follow Remedial Astrology will determine remedies (including natural health substances like herbs, supplements, flower essences, crystals, homeopathic remedies, and so son) based on the indications from the analysis of the astrological influences operative during the possible critical period, and suggest preventive/therapeutic use of those specific remedies.

The methods of identifying possible critical periods are varied: porgression, solar returns, dasa periods and sub-periods (Vedic astrology), transits, Hellenist/Traditionalist technqiue based upon the hyleg and alcohedron, are some of these methods: it is an advanced astrological subject, and requires deep study and understanding of the subject to even approach a reasonable level of accuracy.
 

waybread

Well-known member
Terrcolomba, might I suggest that you simply go to the trouble and expense of finding a professional astrologer on-line who will do these calculations for you, since you seem so obsessed with them? Just keep in mind that few professional astrologers will take on this kind of question; and that you personally will have no way of knowing whether or not their predictions are accurate until they do or do not come to pass.

Just a few other reasons why I think "death-clock" predictions don't work, and why I think you should turn to living the best life you can with the time that you have:

1. Certain large-scale natural disasters, bombing attacks, jumbo-jet crashes, and epidemics can kill large numbers of people in a relatively short period of time. For example, thousands of people were killed almost simultaneously during the tsunami that hit Japan in 2011 and the atomic bomb blasts of 1945. It just beggars the imagination to think that all these people somehow had the same astrological "death" signatures in their charts.

2. People in the developed industrialized world, for the most part, are living longer than their forebears. Today in the US the average life expectancy for women is in their early 80s; and for men, in their late 70s. It just doesn't make sense that somehow, for hundreds of millions of people, all of the "death-clock" indicators would be pushed back such that half the population essentially dies of old age.

3. Most astrologers, whether professional or amateur, are ethical people. A few are not. In your current emotionally vulnerable and fearful frame of mind, it would be very easy for a scam artist pretending to be knowledgeable to take advantage of you-- and your money.

If an astrologer were to tell you that you would die on a specific date in 6 months time, mightn't that make you feel even more fearful than you do now?

Or imagine somebody spending his life savings and pension, and running up his credit card, because an astrologer told him he would die next year. Then the astrologer was wrong and he lives for two decades, but as a financial burden on his family and society.

Or imagine some grand-kids who want to get their hands on Grannie's inheritance right away, because they consulted an astrologer about her (impending) death and want to pressure her to change her will in their favour before that happens.

Asking for "critical times" may be helpful, but I honestly don't think that's what you are after.
 

dr. farr

Well-known member
Determining possiible critical periods I think is of great therapeutic value (for those who know how to apply astro-therapeutics on a preventive and life-enhancing basis) however I completely agree with Waybread's outlook regarding death-clock/time predictions, and even approximated longevity estimations must be undertaken with great circumspection and only by those who have had years of study and experience in that particular field.
 
Identify the risks suggested by the astrological indications and then avoid taking those risks; further, those (very few in the West) who follow Remedial Astrology will determine remedies (including natural health substances like herbs, supplements, flower essences, crystals, homeopathic remedies, and so son) based on the indications from the analysis of the astrological influences operative during the possible critical period, and suggest preventive/therapeutic use of those specific remedies.

The methods of identifying possible critical periods are varied: porgression, solar returns, dasa periods and sub-periods (Vedic astrology), transits, Hellenist/Traditionalist technqiue based upon the hyleg and alcohedron, are some of these methods: it is an advanced astrological subject, and requires deep study and understanding of the subject to even approach a reasonable level of accuracy.
could you specify what one should look for in their natal chart,progression,solar returns,transits,hyleg and alcohedron technique and dasa periods and sub periods to identify these critical periods?

are dasa sub periods bhukti? are dasa periods vimshottari dasa?

what's pada distances? thanks
 

dr. farr

Well-known member
could you specify what one should look for in their natal chart,progression,solar returns,transits,hyleg and alcohedron technique and dasa periods and sub periods to identify these critical periods?

are dasa sub periods bhukti? are dasa periods vimshottari dasa?

what's pada distances? thanks


These are vast subjects, and would take dozens of pages of posts even to present a summary outline; you must turn to a thorough study of the specific astrological literature on these subjects to develop an understanding of the concepts and methods involved.
 
These are vast subjects, and would take dozens of pages of posts even to present a summary outline; you must turn to a thorough study of the specific astrological literature on these subjects to develop an understanding of the concepts and methods involved.
where can i study these concepts and methods involved?

are dasa sub periods bhukti? are dasa periods vimshottari dasa?

what's pada distances? thanks
 

dr. farr

Well-known member
You seem to be most interested in longevity estimating, so, since Vedic astrology continues to actively emphasize this aspect of astrological analysis, I'll recommend that you study Vedic astrology.

Now, unless you are already proficient in basic (mainstream Parasara) Vedic astrological concepts and methods, the first thing you will have to do is to learn the basics: study these in:
-K. S. Charak's 2 volume "Elements of Vedic Astrology"
(or, if this is too extensive for you, you can instead study G.S. Kapoor's book, "Learn Astrology the Easy Way")

After you have mastered the basics, and tested yourself with at least a dozen or so experimental (test) chart delineations, then you will be ready for a study of the longevity estimation concepts and methodologies.
-first study R. Kumar's "Longevity: a Vedic Approach"
next...
-V. P. Goel's "Unraveling the Puzzle of Longevity"
then...
-Jagad's "Astrology and the Solar Computer"
...after these studies (and these represent the minimal basic work in the Vedic longevity estimation field) you will be able to move on to deeper levels in this field with a study and application of various specialty advanced techniques such as ashtakavarga, special dasa system applications, etc...

(Note: all referenced books are currently easily available online from astroamerica.com; also, pretty much, from Amazon books or abebooks.com)
 
You seem to be most interested in longevity estimating, so, since Vedic astrology continues to actively emphasize this aspect of astrological analysis, I'll recommend that you study Vedic astrology.

Now, unless you are already proficient in basic (mainstream Parasara) Vedic astrological concepts and methods, the first thing you will have to do is to learn the basics: study these in:
-K. S. Charak's 2 volume "Elements of Vedic Astrology"
(or, if this is too extensive for you, you can instead study G.S. Kapoor's book, "Learn Astrology the Easy Way")

After you have mastered the basics, and tested yourself with at least a dozen or so experimental (test) chart delineations, then you will be ready for a study of the longevity estimation concepts and methodologies.
-first study R. Kumar's "Longevity: a Vedic Approach"
next...
-V. P. Goel's "Unraveling the Puzzle of Longevity"
then...
-Jagad's "Astrology and the Solar Computer"
...after these studies (and these represent the minimal basic work in the Vedic longevity estimation field) you will be able to move on to deeper levels in this field with a study and application of various specialty advanced techniques such as ashtakavarga, special dasa system applications, etc...

(Note: all referenced books are currently easily available online from astroamerica.com; also, pretty much, from Amazon books or abebooks.com)
thanks, i will.
what's pada distances?

is the Hellenist/Traditionalist technqiue based upon the hyleg and alcohedron you mentioned, the one JUPITERASC posted on this thread?
 
what's pada distances dr. farr?

is the Hellenist/Traditionalist technqiue based upon the hyleg and alcohedron you mentioned, the one JUPITERASC posted on this thread?

what is the technique anoop.indirapuramghazibad used on this thread called?
 

Claire19

Well-known member
That is the value (the ONLY value, to my way of thinking) in identifying possible critical periods of life-so that measures can be taken, and certain risks avoided, during that period of time, to strengthen the life force of the individual involved. Other than for such preventive/supportive purposes, longevity estimations and death-period predictions are nothing but vain curiosity; however, retrospective (post mortem) chart investigations are of value, in identifying likely casual astrological trends and indications in the chart, but only as instructional for us, in future evaluations of living persons' charts, for estimating critical periods so that SOMETHING CAN BE DONE to support the individual during those critical periods.
I agree death in hindsight is much easier to see and analyse. To attempt to see when a person may pass over takes enormous skill and a lot of work and if one person mentions to the querent a particular date for death and it is wrong, imagine the anguish and also waiting for that day to come around? To ask that question or I should say to take notice, in a forum is not a good idea as there are those who profess to be proficient and those who are not. Giving links to online articles etc., and stating those as gospel is also not a good idea. There are those who know when they will pass over but it is not knowledge given to us all for good reasons.

Concentrate on life I say.
 
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