John Frawley is stand up philosofer

banefranco

Well-known member
In some way I am sceptical to activities of the Moon.I can not say anything but If you look at the charts Cambur (yellow/black-Dordreht(green-white/white),10Oct2008 in 20:00 in leeuwaden Holland,score 2:0, and Zwolle(White-blue/white)-FC Eindhoven(Black-white/white), 10Oct2008 in 20:00 in Zwolle Holland,score 2:2,That makes me confused,practically on the first sight the same charts,why the score is so different.
Thats why I mostly say win and draw.In my program I cannot compare by using an option bewheel becouse it can not place two charts one over another,of course.
You see, Moon as I see does not make any influence on the score.
But prediction who will not lose is also prediction.Maybe thats the way how we have to think.Not who will win.Maybe.But I made couple of times prediction for exact score and was absolutely sure.But Moon aspects were not included.In fact i think that I sent to you aspects I noticed.And there were no Moon aspect or Moon changing House or anything that envolve Moon.Only Rulers of the 1.,7., 10., and 4., houses and only aspects thay make to AS,MC,DC.Even no aspects to the 4.house.And when they change house but stay in the same sign.The rule i can anounce is when the planet change any house but is in its own sign that is goal.But now surprise NOT THE MOON BUT THE MOON NODES.When they make trigo or sextile with MC or AS then rule exists,but when Moon Nodes make square it does not happen.I would like that someone checks it in at least 100 charts.Anyone.There is something that allow chances to be realised.
Well last aspect Moon makes with the one of the rulers indicates winner is out of mind.Sometimes yes sometimes no.That is called 'Street corner talking'.
I spend a lot of time for checking but it depends on many other things.when I check them all I do not need any moon aspect to predict the winner.
And after all, standard methods are precize.This suggestion with the moon I do not like it.Saturn and other planets are indication for goals much better.In short you are right about Saturn in the e.g 10. house.
I would say max two goals.
I am thinking and writing in the same way.
Do not laugh but I try all the time to understand what kind of values-measures God used when created universe.It is not funny.Love is everuthing but here we do not have partners.
I am serious. And now I think that I understand why we cannot predict soccer matches with Horrary astrology,not all the matches.Becouse we are envolved in matter we do not have to be.If I like Bayern Munchen and Herta Berlin and place them on the same side ASC.I need only couple of minutes to predict the winner on one match.What stops me to check another immidiately.And what we got, in one match Bajern-Bochum was draw and in the secon Herta won over Werder in Bremen as a guest.You see that we have weather and tea break problem.That rule is also out of mind I realise I only wasted my time in reading Sport Astrology.
That is why I favour so much your sistem.Becouse I have an umbrella for the system to stay dry.The system nust be stand alone, indipendent.
Ok All my thoughts are for public.I hope that you are realy no the only person who reads this.
Good night.
 

banefranco

Well-known member
By the way I started to read the book by JAN SPILLER 'Astrology for the soul'.
It treats only influence and meaning of the Nodes on about 500 pages.Interesting stimulating and when I finish that book I will translate and implement definitions to prediction for scores in socer.By the way other sports can be predicted on the same base as soccer.Absolutely the same way is in hockey and specially in basketball.But in basketball I cannot predict the score still but I hope that results will come.Mathematics.I will try even I know that nobody is interested in score in basketball.But it can be accepted when you predict total points on the match.Over-under.Some other time and not so soon.
 

fensi88

Well-known member
Thats why I mostly say win and draw.In my program I cannot compare by using an option bewheel becouse it can not place two charts one over another,of course.
You do not have option "tranzit chart"? I use this option when I want to see two charts.

The rule i can anounce is when the planet change any house but is in its own sign that is goal.But now surprise NOT THE MOON BUT THE MOON NODES.When they make trigo or sextile with MC or AS then rule exists,but when Moon Nodes make square it does not happen.I would like that someone checks it in at least 100 charts.Anyone.There is something that allow chances to be realised.

What orb do you use?

My main problem is how to determine sure draw.

Well last aspect Moon makes with the one of the rulers indicates winner is out of mind.Sometimes yes sometimes no.

Yes, I noticed that, you are right.

I will try even I know that nobody is interested in score in basketball.
No, you are not right, here are many of basketball fans(I am not one of them) and I saw many times thay asked how to predict score, so definately you will make tham happy if you find the method. I am really happy that there exist so enthusiastic person as you, because without of such person we will be for ages in same place and never see futher from our nose.

(I will check out that 2 matches you wrote about, later in the evening).
 

fensi88

Well-known member
In match which ended with 2:2 Ve, ruler of 1st house is less than 5 degrees from DSC, so it counts as in 7 house. When I do planet strenght I found for Ve=10 for Ma=9

In match wich ended with 2:0 when I do planet strenght I found for Ve=4 for Ma=9

OK, for first one it is equal, but for second one it is not so much difference to be sure that one of team would win.

Also I do not know if that is something important, but I found in chart which ended as 2:0 that part of victory is 55' from NN, but in chart which ended as 2:2 part of victory is 1:51' from NN.

I think the most important thing in these type of charts, which is VERY simmilar to see why in some moment on one match(in one chart) was goal, and why in same moment in second chart there was no goal.

This charts as examples are not good for this purpose because in chart which ended as 2:2, 3 goals were in 2nd half so I have no exact time because I do not know exact how long was pause between 1st and 2nd half.
So if someone has 2 similar chart with different results and with goals in 1st half, please post.
 

banefranco

Well-known member
Next time I will take care about goals to be scored in the first half of the match.
I understand the point.
I use only three degrees for judgement is the ruler on the house cusp or not.
If I should get permanent precize misses that is easy to change.
Why I say this.In many books there are values between 2-7 degrees.It is so elastic that I simply cannot accept.
And that can make big confusion in reading astro charts.
And for Moon Nodes I will also take care about how close is POF.And ANTISCION,APOF of course. But I also continue to take care about aspects Nodes make to MC.
But lets see what happend at the match Serbia(Red-Blue)-Lithuania(Yellow/Green), 20:15 LT,Belgrade,Serbia(Yugoslavia)
You can count that I predicted not the winner but even 1-1.
Of course I do have photocopy of my betting coupon.
I will mention just the placement of powerfull Pluto, Aplication aspect conjunction between POF and JU as the ruler of the 7.house and how close the South node is to the cusp of the 4. house from inside.
I will not mention that the moon is in detriment of Mercury,ruler of the 1.house.and its position explained let say bad game Lithuania made.I will not mention Neptune in the 10.house which indicates confused game for Lithuania also and I will not mention Chiron in the 10.house as a little bit of nervous game.The North node did not help them all also situated in the 10.house.
I want to tell how Pluto strongly influence to the DSC even nobody notified that planet in the middle ages.But it existed for pretty long time and it still be.Thank to God for letting us found it.
And aspect conjunction between JU and POF is like you cross the street on the red light and you are in danger but someone whom you do not see becouse is at your back pull you back to the foot-pavemment.That is how I interprete conjunction.In both cases when it favours you or does not.So now I would like to have someone to say that Conjunction is not an aspect.Of course it is.Or if anyone denies that holding the body is not a contact.
Thats all for now.
 

banefranco

Well-known member
I appologize I missed to see your comment on basketball etc.
Here is my answer.I use 3 degrees orb for any situation I may have, just becouse it is reasonable for me.It is quiet correct distance.Let say that it is the place for making strong definitions.As the planet is strong itself the wider range if influence it makes.That is so natural.And I wonder why noone made the table of planet strenths and orbs each planet impact to others.Or I did not find that information. But precize definitions.
I would compare it when you are in a good health, you move, you talk, you act I would say and you impact to others strongly, but when you are ill you stay in bed.So there are definite values you use when the planet is in its exaltation and in its detriment e.g.And it is not from 2-7 degrees it is exact value.
If I answer when the planet is stronger in a position use wider range of influence it makes and when is in fall or detriment use closer range that is too philosofic too relative from me, I really expect much better from myself.
At some other time I will make that table.
You will find in some books there is the same stupid question, That astrologers use definitions for Essential Dig. for planets with just mentioning the values from 1-10.
And clever question ''1 of what ? measure.How stupid man can be to ask that question.
If you say that someone has strenth of 1 and the other has the strenth of 10 I really think that it is the question for kids to answer. Even them will all answer you the right question.Those astrologers have to learn basic mathematics.Seems to be that they used many breaks (Not the stars)and did not attend lessons.
About basketball let me tell that the secret is how will you count the information of one.If you find the score 6 in the chart just count is as 6 times 20 points or 12 points and you will get results.
Ohhh that is something for us to examinate.
I am sure I will not get a question like some Geniouses can make.
 

banefranco

Well-known member
It is fantastic opportunity to compare two fixed charts.I will ask for help from help desk.
All I say here I can see very quickly on that way.On the other hand I will prin the charts and place them one over another.Not one over one buth ten charts over.And I sure that answer will be visible.You will find orbs definitions,you will find exact values,you will find planetary influences they make in accordance of strenth.That is powerfull opportunity
But I predict that I will have the stupid explanation that house bondaries deffers from chart to chart.So what ?
I just want from software to do what I ask not to channeling me in its way.
I'll try anyway.
 

banefranco

Well-known member
Ok,
Let us analize soccer match Bolivia-Uruguay, 14 OCT 2008, 16:00 LT(local time),La Paz, Bolivia.
I use colour method so I will place Bolivia as DSC and Uruguay as ASC.
It is really hard to tell Who is favourite in this match.
In these cases I really think that methods like ASC is place for favourite, ASC is home team are useless.
As you wish, but I will mention some other things. Rulers of the 1. and the 7. house.It seems to be JU is weak and let us say ME is better placed.But I prefer to say no matter how weak JU is it is always very strong.It placement in the 10 H indicate that ASC team plays close and strong defend.Close becouse of JU in fall and strong becouse of Pluto.Possible to score goal from contraatacks.
Now take a look not 4.house than 7.house.Placement of SA indicate there will be no goals for the time untill it leaves the 7.h.Do not push me to tell you in minutes.It is easy.And when it leaves it is possible for ASC to score the goal due to POF part of fortune will stay for very short time at the cusp of the 7.h. Luck changes.But here it will lasts first half of the game.
Now take a look about the sun in fall in the 8.h It enters very soon 7.h What strenth it posseses.None.
But quiet enough to make some grill to the ruler of the 7.h ME(17 degrees from the SUN makes planet little grilled.Closer the stronger).
What now.
In the second half rulers of the 1.h and 7.h changes and I want to follow that change.Now ASC team took a place in the 7.h,became DSC and DSC team is in the 1.h., became ASC. Here is the problem Bolivia will play in green jerseys but dark green jerseys and Uruguay will play in light blue with black small details jersey.If you follow colour method you will wonder where to place Bolivia,becouse there are green colours at both sides.But light blue is just on the Libra sida (DSC).And Ruler of the 7.h. is VE in scorpio.There is also black colour involved.So my decision is Bolivia is now ASC and Uruguay is DSC.And final prediction is Uruguay will win.
I hope I was clear in prediction.
Waiting for different aproach.
 

banefranco

Well-known member
Sorry,
I mentioned just possibility for scoring the goal despite of POF presented in the 7.h. If you watch that one team misses 100% chance for goal just becouse of POF presented in the house of the opponent.
Also it scores the goal from funny situation if POF is presented in his house.That is matter of luck.
Well just sayng.
And by the way the point is I wont to break the rule how we place favourite according to place of playing the match wether it is Home or Away wether it is favourite or not.Wether we are interested hardly in match.Who cares.ANY MATCH AT ANY TIME AT ANY PLACE CAN BE PREDICTED.The question is are we good enough.
 

fensi88

Well-known member
I come to same result. I asign Uruguay to ASC, because of blue(Ju) black(Sa) sport kit. Its ruler Ju is in angular house, direct and swift, in house of joy, and applaying to trine POF and sextile ASC. Also, AJu is right on MC.

But quiet enough to make some grill to the ruler of the 7.h ME(17 degrees from the SUN makes planet little grilled.
:rotflmao:
 
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banefranco

Well-known member
Ok, Bolivia-Uruguay, Post festum
In my earlier replies I mentioned that I use to predict like double chance, double outcomes.That is how good I am and I did not miss by using colour method when deciding where are the teams placed.This time I have to learn something from Part of fortune,I just undervalued its impact in the first half of the game.Indeed I very rare predict more precize outcome.Today I just tried and I must say that still more time will pass to predict precizely every single match.But Every match can be predicted precizely and I will continue this work.
 

fensi88

Well-known member
Bolivia-Uruguay 2:2
Yes, that POF so close to DSC, orb 2', was strong testimony for Bolivia, but I did not know if it will work good for them because POF is in same degree as Nodes (usually that means some sort of catastrophe).
 
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banefranco

Well-known member
Just for the others,
If you take a look for two replies above I wrote about POF where placed and what goals are scored or not.I wrote that when one team scores the goal from funny situation where we do not expect goal that POF is in its house.That is scored goal by luck.And Bolivia scored even two goals in the first half and POF was situated in its ruler's house (that was in the 7.house.). Now when you do not follow your personal rules you must miss.
 
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banefranco

Well-known member
Hello all,
I decided to give to you two samples why Frawley's rule how we place ASC team and DSC team is useless.I would say if you use it you can be constantly wrong.
Take a look at the image named Gijon, first image from the left..That is the chart for soccer match Gijon-Barcelona ( you have all details on the image).
If you place Gijon as ASC team and find Mars in the 7.house the rule for placement of the ruler of the 1st house close to the cusp inside the 7.house which tells that ASC team loses is acceptable.
When you use the same rule for placement Home team as it was in the chart Gijon you will place Austria at ASC team (second chart image).Now when you use JF rule last Moon aspect with the ruller of the 1 or 7 gives winner, you will be wrong.Austria lost that game 3:1.
So something is wrong with these rules becouse in first sample Gijon lost and in the second Austria lost.Who faild. There is more folks.
When you use colour method for both placements You will place Barcelona in 1st chart at ASC and Serbia in 2nd chart at ASC. In both cases ASC teams won but the rule for placement ruler of the 1st house in the 7th house did not work.
In the second chart,Austria-Serbia the rule for Moon aspect to ruler of the 1st house in this case mercury worked.
Finally who is crazy here.I will not tell anything about it.It is up to you.
I will tell you my opinion accept it or do your way.
Colour method gives 100% precize results and eliminates surprises in results in soccer matches.If you use Frawley's method you will be often badly surprised like you gamble.And for the guess you do not need to use astrology.
When you use colour method you will find the rule for placement ruler of the 1st house in the 7.th useless.And it is in fact.I already gave very plastic information in my earlier replies.
In the chart Austria-Serbia if you use colour method you will predict right.
But I do not want to discuss about Moon aspects untill I prepare some samples that that rule works rearely.So wait for the proof.In this moment I prepare samples for the rule where the planet is within 8 and 30' far from the Sun.
 

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banefranco

Well-known member
Ok fellows,
At the botom you will find enclosed two charts,soccer matches from Holland 2. league,matches starts at the same time On the 17 Oct 2008 at 20:00 but the charts are similar becouse of small distance between places.
Let us predict them all, right.
You have all details on the charts themselves. but if you use colour method let me inform you that Haarlem plays in black jersey - Excelsior in white,
Venlo plays in Yellow/black - Telstar in white.
If we follow the rule-Last Moon aspect with the one of the rulers of the 1. or 7. gives winner we do not have to analize the whole charts, do we.
And the Moon makes aplication aspect with Mercury ruler of the first house, voila.
That means if you place teams according to colours you will find winners as guest teams.
If you place teams according to wether they are home or away teams or favourites let see what will happen.
Becouse I am suspicious I will predict Ecelsior and Telstar to win or possible draw.
PS sorry i forget to mention if you want to check colour of jerseys you can do it at
http://www.soccerway.com
 

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banefranco

Well-known member
I know that it is not the place,
But one person named STARFLOWER made the best comment I have ever heard in my whole life.That was so spectacular that I can compare like earthquake.
I wish to use words in that way.
With full recpect and obeisance.
I do apologize to all the others.
 

fensi88

Well-known member
Regarding Gijon-Barcelona and Frawleys method=favorite on ASC, Barsa is on ASC and according to Frawley, Ma so close inside DSC cup must lose. And Moon last trine Ve, so DSC team by JF must win, but both rules failed.You are apsolutelly right. (I check out antiscions also).
 

fensi88

Well-known member
Yes, Excelsior Rotterdam with white sport kit will be represented with ASC, and because Moon is so close to ASC, and above all has applaying aspect with Me I also predict Excelsior Rotterdam will win. Part of Victory is also on ASC.
 

banefranco

Well-known member
I appologize I mention inkonjunction in Austria-Serbia, Moon inkonjunction Mercury..If you do horary you do not recognize that aspect.Let say I would like to operate with as little terms as possible becouse it is much easier.And I personally have very unpleasant inkonjunction in my birth chart I would rather eliminate from my sight.Simply forget inkonjunction it is my advice not only my personal interest for that to not exist.Do not use it in prediction in sport matches.It just happend in Austria-Serbia chart.But I cannot avoid Pluto Neptun and Uranus,becouse it was in many cases information how the teams play and Neptun defines confused game of aspected ruler specially when placed in 10 or 4 house also when placed in the 1 and 7.it indicate I would like to use the right word restless.
Pluto in this moment indicate more strenth and Uranos oh my god too much feelings and love to the grass on the playfield ground.I took great care when stellium of those three planets are involved I will place to you a chart.Not today.
But nobody even asked me how I use the colour table to answer.
Well I use only seven planets and their definitions and all signs of zodiac.
Why just becouse it helps me to make clear position of the teams involved in match.
Thats for now.
 

banefranco

Well-known member
NOW LET US FACE the TROUTH.
In the match Haarlem-Excelsior we already discussed, the score came 2:1.
We predicted that Excelsior to win.But it was opposite.
If you use stupid John Frawley's rule to place favourite at ASC and that was Excelsior, it lose.
If you used the also stupid rule that last Moon aspect to the ruler indicates winner you will lose.
Now, when you place bets on his rules you will lose.
It is big difference between when you lose your money and follow someones rules and when you make academic discusion about those rules.
It is the same for you becouse you are not really interested wether it works or not.
But when you start to lose yours money you will become angry and your anger will grow.
I am deeply sorry that there are not much more people to visit this thread becouse everything is argumented.
And if you read carefully that man makes criteria about very exact things.If testimony is weak it is weak not weaker stronger les or more.It is or it is not.
If the baby writes the book you cannot ask for responsibility, but I wonder what kind of scruple that man can have when decide to write such fakes.
Above all I already warned all of you with big letters DO NOT PLACE YOUR MONEY ON MOON ASPECTS.That just tells about the quality of the game, nothing else.
I honourly accepted to be the student for life but John Frawley as a Master deserves the thickest stick the world ever made.
 
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