love horaries

Kaiousei no Senshi

Premium Member
Well...I'm about to blow your mind here.

About your first example, it's likely that the terms you're using are incorrect. There's a big hub-bub about using Ptolemy's terms because there are apparently a couple of different tables that are credited to Ptolemy and no one is really sure which one is the original. Most traditional astrologers use the Egyptian terms (there's only ever been one set of those) and it's possible that in that system Jupiter is not in Mercury's terms.

Secondly, Term is a very weak type of reception that can't really be counted on to accomplish anything by itself. I believe term shows someone that is "about to be cast out of doors", which could explain his attitude towards you after all.
 

SagSunScorpioMoon

Well-known member
Well...I'm about to blow your mind here.

About your first example, it's likely that the terms you're using are incorrect. There's a big hub-bub about using Ptolemy's terms because there are apparently a couple of different tables that are credited to Ptolemy and no one is really sure which one is the original. Most traditional astrologers use the Egyptian terms (there's only ever been one set of those) and it's possible that in that system Jupiter is not in Mercury's terms.

Secondly, Term is a very weak type of reception that can't really be counted on to accomplish anything by itself. I believe term shows someone that is "about to be cast out of doors", which could explain his attitude towards you after all.
Oh! Well i used the one that posted the link to earlier in the thread.

But then based on that, if he is about to cast me out of doors :)lol: he probably already did by the time that chart was erected!), then shouldn't I have already kicked him out considering my planet Mercury is even less fond of Jupiter! By the way, I'm Mercury, he's Jupiter.

Regarding the Egyptian terms, i found one here, I'm assuming this is the one most traditional astrologers use?
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/dig3.html

Now i'm assuming this chart works the same way as Ptolemy's chart?
So, any planet in the first 6 degrees (0 degree - 5degree59mins) of Aries is in the Term of Jupiter? I.e. they are received by Jupiter by Term?

What do the numbers in brackets mean?
 
Last edited:

Kaiousei no Senshi

Premium Member
Oh! Well i used the one that posted the link to earlier in the thread.

But then based on that, if he is about to cast me out of doors :)lol: he probably already did by the time that chart was erected!), then shouldn't I have already kicked him out considering my planet Mercury is even less fond of Jupiter! By the way, I'm Mercury, he's Jupiter.

Typically yes, but something I've noticed is that the querent's significator usually won't receive the queisted. It's kind of strange because you would think they would, but they just don't seem to a lot. I'm not sure what this could really mean other than the querent's feelings for the queisted is probably already obvious and not the subject of the question.

Yes, the Egyptian Terms are used the same way as the others. The numbers in brackets refer to the actual degrees of the Sign the planet's term ends at. Venus takes the 6 degrees after Jupiter's 6, so hers end at 12° Aries, then Mercury takes the next 8° after Venus's to reach 20° and so on.
 

Aquarius358

Well-known member
...
Regarding the Egyptian terms, i found one here, I'm assuming this is the one most traditional astrologers use?
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/dig3.html

Now i'm assuming this chart works the same way as Ptolemy's chart?
So, any planet in the first 6 degrees (0 degree - 5degree59mins) of Aries is in the Term of Jupiter? I.e. they are received by Jupiter by Term?

What do the numbers in brackets mean?

This may help - There's a Table of Essential Dignities (Egyptian) at the Academy of Astrology website : www.academyofastrology.org

The way Helena Avelar & Luis Ribeiro have put it up there might help to read it a bit more easily:
It seems the Egyptian Table uses exactly the same order of planets for the 5 sections within Terms : ie Jupiter, Venus, Mercury, Mars and Saturn as Lilly does. For Aries, a greater number of degrees is given to Mercury and cuts off a couple of degrees from Venus (which is interesting!)

In ARIES then, using their table you can see:
0deg - 5deg59 = Jupiter's Term
6deg - 11deg59 = Venus' Term
12 deg - 19deg59 = Mercury's Term
20 deg - 24deg59 = Mars' Term
25 deg - 29deg59 = Saturn's Term.

I wonder if anyone's done any research comparing the two Tables of Essential Dignities and the subtle difference in the number of degrees in the Term allocated affecting an outcome??? Mmmm ...!_________
 
Last edited:

Aquarius358

Well-known member
SagSunScorpioMoon;385981 said:
...
But here's the confusing part!!! I'm pretty sure I've seen half a dozen of charts like that and the interpretation is: The guy loves her because he (Mars) is in the sign she (Venus) rules, regardless of what sign Venus is actually in.
So how does this work? It's driving me crazy :w00t:

Hi, Everybody’s got a way of talking about reception - and I defend their right to do that ... BUT ... the wording is so important, I reckon: ie it’s clearer to say “Planet X receives Planet Y” (rather than “Planet Y is received by Planet X”). This distinction is important, I think, because active language is easier to understand.

I don’t think ‘power’ or ‘control’ of one party over the other is involved in Reception - especially in relationship questions, I believe it’s feelings.

So ... if Planet X receives Planet Y and Planet Y receives Planet X (called “mutual reception”) -

- BY SIGN (ie in "domicile") this signifies they both have a genuine / strong liking for each other. The best. Love. Strong love. The overwhelming feeling ‘I don’t want to live without this person’ stuff. The grand passion. Willing to commit to a serious relationship. [Give it a + 10]

- BY EXALTATION signifies they put each other on a pedestal / over the moon about each other, but it also usually involves 'expectations' - perhaps too many expectations which could mean the relationship will not last. Not always necessarily doomed to ultimate failure tho ... it could still lead to a serious commitment but it’s more an infatuation than the ultimate grand passion. [Give it a + 8]

- BY TRIPLICITY signifies they think of each other in a lesser way than by Sign & Exaltn - best described as a kind of liking and helpfulness but nothing like real love. This could be for many reasons - including the fact that they’re a cautious person by nature. Maybe you like them as mates and are willing to hang out but definitely not the Real Thing. [Give it a + 5]

- BY TERM signifies they both have lesser or weaker feelings that are just ... tolerating each other. Not willing to spend much time on the relationship. [Give it a +3 or 4]

- BY FACE, signifies well, practically nothing at all. Very little emotion attached to the relationship. No commitment at all. [Give it +1 or 2.]

If, however, there’s a MIX of reception, then ONE party will have something like the feelings above described.

THE ASPECT that must go with Reception is necessary to indicate whether or not some action is likely to be taken or that there’s a chance of the parties getting together in a physical sense - not necessarily for sex, but at least for a coffee. The aspect is essential, I guess, because if planets can’t ‘see’ each other, be within each other’s influence, how can they ‘receive’ each other?! or make their ‘reception’ or feelings known to the other?

Just some thoughts ...______
 

Aquarius358

Well-known member
This may help - There's a Table of Essential Dignities (Egyptian) at the Academy of Astrology website : www.academyofastrology.org

The way Helena Avelar & Luis Ribeiro have put it up there might help to read it a bit more easily:
It seems the Egyptian Table uses exactly the same order of planets for the 5 sections within Terms : ie Jupiter, Venus, Mercury, Mars and Saturn as Lilly does. For Aries, a greater number of degrees is given to Mercury and cuts off a couple of degrees from Venus (which is interesting!)

I take it back! I got it WRONG !! ... the Egyptian Table does NOT use the same ORDER of planets for the 5 columns - in fact, on closer examination (I've not ever used it) there's quite a difference in the number of degrees that a planet has that Term for, (1 deg - 4 deg difference) and also the ORDER of the planets also differs for some of the Signs - eg Gemini, Cancer and Leo.

Comment on using Egyptian versus Ptolemy's Table of Essential Dignities : I think if the latter was good enough for William Lilly and subsequent astrologers who seem to have been using it successfully for a couple of centuries, then I think I'll keep on using Ptolemy's Essential Table of Dignities as set out in Christian Astrology by Lilly and used by many, many astrologers since then. Until someone does enough research, I'd reckon that an astrologer must make up their own mind as to which they would use.

Medieval astrologers would use the Egyptian Table I guess. _______
 
Last edited:

SagiCap

Well-known member
I take it back! I got it WRONG !! ... the Egyptian Table does NOT use the same ORDER of planets for the 5 columns - in fact, on closer examination (I've not ever used it) there's quite a difference in the number of degrees that a planet has that Term for, (1 deg - 4 deg difference) and also the ORDER of the planets also differs for some of the Signs - eg Gemini, Cancer and Leo.

Comment on using Egyptian versus Ptolemy's Table of Essential Dignities : I think if the latter was good enough for William Lilly and subsequent astrologers who seem to have been using it successfully for a couple of centuries, then I think I'll keep on using Ptolemy's Essential Table of Dignities as set out in Christian Astrology by Lilly and used by many, many astrologers since then. Until someone does enough research, I'd reckon that an astrologer must make up their own mind as to which they would use.

Medieval astrologers would use the Egyptian Table I guess. _______

Link doesn't seem to work, my dear. :)

So how do you actually read the Egyptian Terms? What does the 1-5 at the top stand for?
 

Kaiousei no Senshi

Premium Member
So how do you actually read the Egyptian Terms? What does the 1-5 at the top stand for?

That's how many different terms for each sign. There are only five planets that have terms, so they number them who has first, second, third, fourth, and fifth division in each sign.

Keep the questions coming about the Egyptian Terms, I feel like I'm on a roll. :D
 

Aquarius358

Well-known member
Link doesn't seem to work, my dear. :)

Oh dear - sorry 'bout that! Shame, too. It was a good website & had some excellent tables and charts - it was Helena Avelar and Luis Ribeiro's. They had put the Almuten beside the Dignities as well ...

So how do you actually read the Egyptian Terms? What does the 1-5 at the top stand for?

Same as I described in detail above in reply to SagSunScorpioMoon's post on 1 May - which was helping her to read Ptolemy's Table of Ess.Dignities.

She gave the example of 17 Aries which is in Mercury's Term in both Egyptian and Ptolemy's Tables.

Thanks for the link to the giahorary site.___
 
Top