A Runic Explanation of the Zodiac
 

"Greetings,I thought that I'd throw another theory of mine into the mix.
It has to do with a hypothesis of mine that I and a few assosciates think makes very good sense. When I completed it [at least as complete as I have managed to date] my friend Suryakant, a yogi, whom is of Norweigan ancestry, said: "This is 'Runic'."
It involves, primarily, the 'Triplicities'. This would be in additiion to the present theories.
All elements represented in the Zodiac should be thought of as 'On the Earth', 'Above the Earth' and 'Below the Earth'.

The Signs Leo, Cancer, Gemini and Taurus are elements 'On the Earth".
The Signs Aries, Pisces, Aquarius and Capricorn are the elements 'Above the Earth'
The Signs Sagittarius, Scorpio, Libra and Virgo are the elements 'Below the Earth'

This makes sense. Of the element, Earth, Taurus is known to rule the plains, valleys and pastures, hence, 'On the Earth'. Capricorn rules the mountains, hence 'Above the Earth'. Virgo the caves, 'Below the Earth'

Now about the Fire signs. Leo rules fire by combustion and although it in turn is ruled by the Sun, the Suns' heat is not felt until it strikes the surface of the Earth, hence, 'On the Earth'. Aries rules electrical fire and that is, in its' most natural and common state, lightning, hence, 'Above the Earth', That leaves Sag., which rules fire by friction and it would have to be 'Below the Earth'. [Fire below the Earth created by the frictions of movement below us]

As for Water. Cancer represents all waters 'On the Earth', Pisces, 'Above the Earth', meaning it rules the rains, [which in turn without there would be no streams or rivers, which the old notion believes that it does rule rivers and streams] and Scorpio 'Below the Earth' which gives support and is in turn supported by the old notion that it rules swamps and things of that nature that are fed by underground water sources.

For the Air signs. Gemini is known to represent the exhalation of breath and would be considered 'On the Earth'. Libra the in between breath, 'Below the Earth' and Aquarius, the inhalation breath, 'Above the Earth' This makes sense as per the legend that Aquarius is the "Water Bearer" as it's considered 'Air above the Earth' and Pisces, as explained above, 'Water above the Earth' [Rains]...I believe you should see what we are getting at here. That Aquarius is the upper atmosphere that is required to dispense rain.

As I explained at the Astrodienst Astrologers f0rum, there is a program that aired the day after I came up with this explanation. It was on the 'History Channel' here in the States on cable television. This program was about modern weapons and discussed a Russian sub that was built to withstand great depths and had an exceptionally strong hull.
This submarine sank in water so deep that its hull collapsed eventually. The narrator said that when the hull did finally collapse that the men inside couldn't have suffered very long as there would have been an explosion created by the friction of the water rushing in under such extreme pressure that the air in the sub would ignite! Water igniting Air!!!

Now take this "Runic" arrangement and note the following.

A Submarine is somewhat of a cave...Virgo.

The Air inside the Sub, not unlike the air in a cave...Libra.

Water rushes into the cave...Scorpio.

Leads to fire by friction...Sagittarius.

I would also like to have you consider the book of the Bible Genesis for this analogy.

In the beginning there was only the 'waters of the deep'...Cancer.

The breath [wind] blew over the waters...Gemini

The lands appeared...Taurus.
One last thing to add here is my proposed re-arrangement of the duplicity of positive and negative signs.

As it is currently accepted you end up with postive and negative always opposing one another in the Zodiac. This is un-natural, as Tesla proved Edisons generator [Direct Current] was and was thus in-efficient.
Tesla claimed to have gotten the inspiration for his Alternator [Alternating Current] from the universe around him.

Thus the Zodiac should be divided half and half not unlike the Yin-Yang diagram. We believe Leo, Virgo, Libra, Scorpio, Sag. and Cap. to be the 'positive' signs and the remainder to be the 'negative'

Of course this leads to the conclusion that there are positive and negative types of both sexes...and a host of other new considerations. [I have another posting on this, theory of mine as to what I derived from Tesla about energy polarity elsewhere in this forum in a thread on Masculinity and Femininity]
The point here is that possibly all laws of the physical universe can be found in a proper explanation of the Zodiac.

Thus leaving one to conclude that Astrology is not only a science but the Mother of all Science."
_________________

...."excerpt from the 'Rudhyar Archival Project', "Uranus Versus Saturn, the Value of Inconsistency"[I beleive this is okay as per the copyrights].

"When we say of a person bringing up an argument to prove a point that he is "consistent," we mean that his speech reveals a continuous sequence of known causes and expected results, of accepted premises and rational deductions. The continuity of his thinking is evident, and the arguments are contained within the framework of a well-tested logic. The trouble with such a procedure, however, is that it produces only results of the same order as the experiences which originally helped to devise the procedure. In a very real sense, the nature and quality of one's search condition in advance what one will find. If we use Saturnian means to solve a problem, the solution will not leave the realm of Saturn. Likewise, all the discoveries of modern science are conditioned by the scientific methods and quantitative techniques used in the process of discovery. The universe we see today is the universe as our "scientific" mind allows us to see it. It assuredly is not the universe in all its reality! It is the universe seen through the Saturnian consistency of our logical ways of thinking."

[some hours later] I realized in reading the initial post that mention was made of 'MESO', a term I have never heard before applied in the manner it was.
I mean, I have heard and am quite familiar with 'microcosom' and 'macrocosom' but had never given any thought to it beyond that. I had to ponder for a moment what "meso" meant...and then I realized it's representative of what is manifest to us on this plane.
Thus the whole concept of 'Macro', 'Meso' and 'Micro' is the same as "Above the Earth", "On the Earth" and "Below the Earth"...is it not?
Also I've found connections between scientific fact of observable processes of nature and the application of musical tonality to the Zodiac. That is, my explanation of musical tonality as to how it corresponds with the Zodiac. [I can provide the explanation and examples if asked to.]
I see Astrologers as divided into two groups: Those that are mechanically proficient and those that are 'seers' i.e. those folks that can vizualize the overall 'Gestalt' of the astrological situation...and possibly a third group that can do both....I see myself as belonging to the second group...but I am aspiring to be part of the third group.

__________________________________________________ ________


I was watching the History Channel here in the States the other night and caught a program on the formation of the Earth.
In this program the narrator talked about how when underground water hit seams of molten lava underground it solidified those seams into 'strata' and they eventually were thrust upwards into mountains.

...underground water > Scorpio
...underground molten lava > Sagittarius
...above the Earth mountains > Capricorn

...AH! The plot thickens!

...ps, check out my thread in the 'Numbers and Astrology" sub-forum titled "The Seven and the Five"
http://actastrology.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=177
as to what developed from that theory has some scientific application/implication which you all may find of some interest.

...also, it's been my observation, and it's been pointed out to me, that as a result of this 'arrangement' of the nature of the Zodiac it is implied that the waters "Above the Earth" [Pisces], are just as influenced by the Moon as the waters "On the Earth" [Cancer]...an interesting conjecture!
__________________________________________________ ____________________

...in support of evidence for this 'Runic Theory', I offer this post from a thread at the Sabian Forum...about the oil platform fire in the Gulf of Mexico

By Runic Astrological theory [I've got a post of this Runic thing here at this forum], [Elements Above the Earth, On the Earth, & Below the Earth] Virgo rules Earth-Below the Earth. i.e., e.g. 'Caves' {notice the womb implication} and oil is an earth element /substance from cave like pockets. Saturn is presently in the last degrees of Virgo. Aries rules Fire-Above the Earth i.e. e.g. 'Lightning'...but also all electrical fire. As Uranus is about to enter Aries I suspect the fire and was some sort of electrical fire that got out of hand or just downright caused an explosion. [Pisces is a water sign, of course, but by Runic theory it rules Water-Above the Earth [hence 'Rain/Snow'..which without there would be no streams/rivers...which has become mistakenly identified with Piscean rulership...Cancer rules all Water-On the Earth.]
This combo of Saturn 'The Lesson Giver...the Distributor of Karma' in opposition to Uranus, "The Great Awakener...The Deliverer of Sudden Change' has caused some mayhem...that's for sure...whether it proves to have been caused by somthing 'electrical' remains to be seen...I'll certainly be following the story.
..and in added observation, as my brother, Daniel, once said to me [taught me]..."The last degree of a Sign is where all the lessons of that Sign come to bear pressure...a tough degree [the 30th] for anyone to have a Natal Planet in their birth chart" [Esp. Moon in Capricorn!]...as this event occured so close to the last degree of Virgo and Pisces simultaneously ...it certainly does make sense.
[update...2 days later}
..well, the latest theory on the Oil platform explosion/fire is due to a bubble of methane gas...Libra represents Air Below the Earth..and Saturn was briefly in Libra [Air Below the Earth] before returning to Virgo...it keeps adding up ...!

Re: A Runic Explanation of the Zodiac
 

Does this not mean, then, that we could make conjectures as to proper explanations of the Zodiac and from these derive physical laws, or use known physical laws of the universe to derive a proper explanation of the zodiac? (However this raises the question of how much we know of laws in respect to the physical world and whether modern theories may be incorrect.)

Re: A Runic Explanation of the Zodiac
 

I believe it will quite probably work both ways...that is, find what is correctly known and rectify what isn't.

Re: A Runic Explanation of the Zodiac
 

Greetings again. This is a tad off subject. I was wondering if someone with oceanographic understanding could answer me a question?
As I was sitting here evisioning what I've proposed, my mind played with a picture of "Seas of water" in the atmosphere being subjected to the pull of the Moon as are the seas on the Earth. I thought about how storms are 'low pressure' systems.
The Oceans of the world are "low pressure" systems, then it stands to reason, as they flow in the same direction [counter clockwise here in the Northern Hemis,].
Thus if atmospheric "low pressure" systems are of less pressure as you move to the center of them is not the same true of pressure in the oceans on the Earth?

...anyone?
In appreciation, ptv

Re: A Runic Explanation of the Zodiac
 

Wow, I am impressive. Have you tried to... get this information out in the world a bit? Shown any scientists?

I don't know anything really about oceans, pressures etc. Doesn't the pressure... well, yes, the pressure does increase the deeper you get... greater force due to the greater mass of water... anyway, did you find an answer for that?

Re: A Runic Explanation of the Zodiac
 

Curious what this would mean for the Nile River, which flows in opposition to everything else....


mod.

Re: A Runic Explanation of the Zodiac
 

That's easily explained. Matter just gets denser below and less dense above.:wink:

Re: A Runic Explanation of the Zodiac
 

Talking to another member here tonight about Tornadoes and, my conclusion, that Tornadoes would be of "Air on the Earth" and Gemini then it stands to reason that another members mentioning an Anthony Lewis whom has written on Horary Astrology and his belief that Uranus rules Tornadoes "has something going for it" in my estimation and opinion....as Uranus is the higher octave ruler of Gemini.
To the above analysis I did on the platform fire it now occurs to me that Uranus higher octave ruler of Air on the Earth ...also the higher octave ruler of Virgo...Earth below the Earth...and Caves, pockets of oil combined with Saturn which by my system of planetary rulership* and association is the higher octave ruler of the signs Leo and Cancer...i.e. "Fire on the Earth" and "Water on the Earth ...i.e. Fire on the water upon the earth which needs air upon the Earth and a fuel, in this case ~ Oil...
I don't know where to take this reasoning from here...maybe there is no where to go with it or even needs to be...but it is more 'fuel for thought' ...


*[yes, it is kids...you can believe what you want...the asteroids were once a planet and as such ruled and still rule over Sag. and Pisces. Jupiter rules over Cap. Think about it...expansion...mountains...i.e. an 'expansion' of the Earth upwards over itself. Aquarius {Air above the Earth and air does have to expand at altitude...it get's less dense...} the sign of the humanitarian and brotherhood. Jupiter the planet of philosophy, brotherhood, giving-gifts...which in turn are an 'expansive' act..charity is very Aquarian and charity is what is called a most expansive gift/form of giving. And Saturn is also known as Chronos...and the Sun and the Moon are the two celestial objects [primo facto] used for time keeping since the dawn of man on Earth. And as the Sun and the Moon are Gods celestial proxies here in our physical realm {it says so in the Bible} it makes perfect sense to reasoning that Saturn being the higher octave is thus given the task of bestowing karma/ handling karmic debt...as that is explicitly reserved for God by his own decree]

Re: A Runic Explanation of the Zodiac
 

Ever since I came up with this arrangement I've been captivated by the fact that 'electricity' represented by Aries/Electrical fire/Fire Above the Earth [Lightning] is across from Virgo/Libra/Scorpio.
I became aware of the man, Nikoli Tesla and his work in late 1971. I subsequently have read a bit on him and for awhile owned a copy of the Czech production. the movie, 'The Secret of Nikoli Tesla', which I thought was very objective as to presenting only what was reputedly seen and corroborated...out side of a few instances such as what Mr. Morgan and Tesla discussed behind closed doors.

But, it was the depiction of the experiments that I found so fascinating ... especially what Tesla was doing in Colorado Springs. Tesla chose that area to develop his theory of producing electricy right from the earth itself ...as he demonstrated to his brother in the film that the earth is a natural commutator...
that Edison'sDirect Current generator was an unnatural and thus in-efficient. [also the reason I state that the current belief of negativsign followed by a positive sign is wrong. Tesla said he saw his Alternator in the Cosmos surrounding the Earth. As it stand s now the belief is that every positive sign has another positive sign for it's polarity and the same for the negative. This is not natural...it does not exist in nature. That's why it is really to be understood as half and half...like the Yin-Yang icon. That is the design of an Alternator.]
Tesla chose Colorado Springs as there were caves and springs underground. That's Virgo, Libra and Scorpio...opposite the sign Aries....electricity.

Today I found this video on youtube. It's an explanation as to the theory I have seen bandied about a bit this past year but hadn't taken the time to check it out...until today. [It's always easier for me to get the basis of an understanding of something technical from one of those ''Science 101' type vids that Freshmen in college get to watch for introductory purposes.]
This is on the belief that the great Pyramids of Egypt were electrical generators of some sort. Watch and note what is mentioned about the underground aquifers... I think most of you will catch my drift here:wink:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHrSu...eature=related

Re: A Runic Explanation of the Zodiac
 

As to more on the last post of mine.
The other evening I tinkered with this concept and had an idea ... I checked the two symbols in the Sabians for the 15th and 16th of Aries and also those for the same of Libra...this arose from an idea of a 'pole' ["pole" in the electrical sense] and the imagery that Nikolai Tesla is said to have drawn in the sand to explain his revelation and theory to his brother[?] that Edison's electrical generator was inefficient due to being an 'unnatural arrangement' at odds with the natural mechanics of the Cosmos.
Here I need to emphasize that...while I and most every one else that uses the Sabian Symbols in applying the abstract concept to human psychology...if this particular set of "Degree Symbols" is in fact valid [..and I'm 99.99% convinced they in fact are ...then they are equally valid for scientific interpretation/understanding... just as I am claiming in this thread that the 'Traditional Signs" and their attendant precepts are. The 'rub' is in seeing it!

Now, Aries 15* is a bit difficult...and to be honest I'm not sure how it supports this theory at all... [wish it had some other description of the symbol than what was given because I do get the sense that "it's in there somewhere" ...so I'm just going to pretty much skip over it but would like to make mention, as to emphasize, that it does refer to a "weaving".
[symbol for Aries 15*can be looked up at this link: http://mindfire.ca/The%20Sabian%20Sy...ies%201-15.htm ]

The symbol for Aries 16* is thus [From Dane Rudhyar's book on the Sabian Symbols, "An Astrological Mandala".}

"NATURE SPIRITS ARE SEEN AT WORK IN THE LIGHT OF SUNSET.

KEYNOTE: Attunement to the potency of invisible forces, of nature."


Now, think of an electrical generator, or an alternator, a cars' distributor [pre-computerized days of the automobile] et al of similar electrical devices.

Libra 15* [ibid.]: "CIRCULAR PATHS.

KEYNOTE: Coming to terms with the inevitability of establishing steady rhythms..."

...and now, recall and picture the 'points' on a distributor [those of you that are old enough to remember a distributor or learned enough to be able to do so.]

Libra 16* [ibid.]: "AFTER A STORM A BOAT LANDING STANDS IN NEED OF RECONSTRUCTION.

KEYNOTE: The need to keep in operation steady links..." ...Keyword: REPAIR."

Now, at this point you'll either "SEE", what I've been getting at here in this post, or you won't.. for those of you that can "See It", please follow along, and permit me to further state that, if this is implying what I think it is, and if my idea that Virgo and Scorpio are 'particularly and quite essentially' involved in this matter, then there has to be at least a singular degree and symbol in both those two signs that are in some sort of mathematical ratio [aspect] to the "Top Dead Center" of both the two Signs of Aries and Libra [Hence why I choose both the 15th and 16th of Aries and Libra as the "TDC" of all Signs is in the middle between the two...that is to say at 15* 30' 30" of all Signs] and it could be found be in the Sabian Symbology...[or should be... it depends upon the one doing the looking...what they know of electrical theory and how well conceptualized the symbols were formulated along these particular 'lines of design' as to give cause to suspect.]

I'm currently playing with a few ideas and even the possibility 'Semi-Squares" in this theoretical model....meaning the 30th and possibly the 29th degrees of Leo and the 1st and 2nd degrees of Sagittarius...that is to say...immediately outside of the signs of Virgo and Scorpio.