Secondary Progressions

[Summery Joy]

Hey all,

I don't get Secondary Progressions. But before I post my question, let's make sure that I understand Secondary Progressions correctly.

A progressed chart for someone who's 20 is calculated based on a date that is 20 days later than their actual birthdate, right?

OK. If I'm correct, then what's the logic? How does this work? I was born on August 15 so now that I'm 26 I should construct a chart for .. what?.. September 10? That's puts my Sun in Virgo. I'm no Virgo! I do not demonstrate any of its qualities, the better or the lesser. Also, the ASC changes eventually.

I'm confused :?

I know there's a another chart called the Solar Arc, what's that and how's it different?

[Angel of Something]

Well, I don't know a lot, but I think I do know the technical difference between a solar arc and secondary progression chart. I believe it was something like a secondary progression chart is just a certain amount of days past your birth, and a solar arc is that you add the number of degrees to each planet (the same way that you add the number of days to the other chart).

And I think the interpretation had more to do with transits than it being a whole new natal chart. You could compare the aspects of the progressed and natal chart. And one thing I like to do with progressed charts is to look at how the sun/moon midpoint for it aspected my natal chart. (Heh, can you tell I like using sun/moon midpoints?)

[Shimmy26]

I don't know of how much help I can be on this topic, but I've heard that the secondary progressions are more to do with evolving on the inside, and transits with evolution on the outside, which could explain why you don't consider yourself very Virgo-y. I'm really still looking into progressions, so I don't know too much. I know, though, when it comes to my chart, I have been most affected by my progressed moon (which is currently in Scorpio, which is very noticeable to me!), and it's more of an inner thing - no one else would particularly notice it, but I sure do. And as for the solar arcs, I did get some charts done up by a professional astrologer a few months ago, but I don't exactly understand them all :D .

[wilsontc]

Heart,

Angel is correct about what a Solar Arc is. Another way to think of it is EVERY planet is progressed at the same rate as the Sun. For this reason a person can look at a chart and figure out where there Solar Arc planets will be. For example, if Pluto is 3 degrees Virgo in the birth chart, when the person becomes 20 there Solar Arc Pluto will be at 23 degrees Virgo (3 + 20 = 23). Noel Tyl, a very famous astrologer, is very fond of Solar Arcs and created an entire book about them called "Solar Arcs". Noel claims that Solar Arcs can be used to predict major life events: for example when Saturn (duty, also career) by Solar Arc conjuncts the Midheaven (outer world), the person will come into some type of career advancement.

Shimmy is also correct about the "inner" effect of progressions. They become more apparent when we analyze how we have changed "inwardly" over the years.

As to trying to find out which astrological system is "reasonable"...to me, they are are ALL unreasonable. The idea that something in the sky so far away has ANY effect at all on me is unreasonable. Similarly, it becomes even more unreasonable when we consider that, due to the procession of the equinoxes, our Western astrology charts don't reflect the true positions of the planets. This is ALL unreasonable...but it works. And, to me, that is the ultimate value of astrology...it works!

Throwing out logic,

Tim

[Summery Joy]

Thanks everyone,

Ok. Let's take it one type at a time. Progressed first. I think I understand the concept.. in theory! I'd like some practical help. Here are my natal and progressed charts. Could you point out the major influences?

http://www.geocities.com/sorehearted/images/natal_prog.gif

If you cannot see the image, go to http://www.geocities.com/sorehearted/natal_prog.htm

Thanks.

[C1]

Thank you for the article on secondary progressions, Radu....very helpful!
C1

[wilsontc]

Heart,

Progressions move VERY slowly, so in any particular chart at any particular time it is highly likely that there will be few, if any, progressions strong enough to be noticeable. A way to "ease" into progressions is to take a look at when a planet changes sign. One of the easiest planets to track is the Sun (it moves about a degree a year in progression charts). So when you were 9 your Sun (self-expression) moved from the Sign Leo (self-expression) to the sign Virgo (daily work). Perhaps there was something which occurred to take you out of the "performing" world and more into the routine world in how you express yourself to others around you.

If we use Solar Arcs, then we can apply this "day for a year" method for ALL the planets. Using this theory, the age of 9 becomes even more important, because by Solar Arc Mercury (thinking) conjuncted (energy is combined with) your Nadir (inner world). This would indicate some type of mental "turning within" at this time of changing self-expression (your progressed Sun is the same as your Solar Arc Sun). At the same age (9) your Solar Arc Moon (home, also emotions) would have come out from the 12th house (spirituality, also confusion) and into the 1rst house (being, also action).

All this would indicate somewhere around the age of 9 something happened which, for you, changed your self-expression, made you think deeply on an internal basis, and brought out your emotions.

Making progress,

Tim

[Summery Joy]

Thank you for the article on secondary progressions, Radu....very helpful!
C1

Huh? Where? When? <looking left and right>

Tim,

Thanks. Wow. Honestly, I don't remember anything from when I was 9. In fact, most of my Childhood memories are not rlated to certain age in my Neptune struck brain. Maybe I was too young to realize I was going through changes. According to what you're saying though, I should feel a huge change in like 16 years when the progressed sun moves to Libra?

[Summery Joy]

Thank you for the article on secondary progressions, Radu....very helpful!
C1

Huh? Where? When? <looking left and right>



Nevermind! :oops:

[wilsontc]

Heart,

That's the idea! When Sun (self-expression) progresses into Libra (relationships) there should be a new expression of yourself in terms of relationships.

And I understand the challenges of understanding progressions: I feel the same way, since I also don't have a detailed memory of my early childhood life. I remember an astrologer attempting to step through my entire life, telling me when significant events in my life had to have happened...and I remembered NOTHING about the times the astrologer was describing as being supposedly so important in my life!

It was at THAT time I decided, if astrology was going to mean anything to me, it would have to be interpreted in the context of MY experiences...not based on what was "supposed" to have happened. So at that point I threw out "Saturn is the father", "Moon is the Mother", "Sun is the father" and all the other personal life details astrology claims to be able to identify, and I onlyh focused in on the "key" meanings of the chart...my way of trying to get to the basics of the experience without trying to recite someone's childhood to them! ;)

And that evolved into the approach I use (and push! ;) ) today!

Making progress,

Tim

[C1]

<<<<<<<8)>>>>>>>>>
< :P> Hi Sore,
This way :arrow: :wink:

You do not miss anything, Ms. Heart!

Anyway, thank you, Sorehearted,
for this progressed thread and for your progressed chart.
*Neptune/Uranus/Pluto/Jupiter/Moon.*...it seems you have lots of interesting aspects
.../zero degree ASC/Taurus, etc.....what's happening is very energetic!

No wonder
you are teaching us to learn progressed charts now :)
Anyway, you've challenged me, an "Astro-dilettante"
to learn more. And I am trying to make sense
because of you! 8)

Tim, I like what you said (to paraphrase you: "...find what is meaningful,")
....connecting the stars and inner light... thanks you all!

C1

[Summery Joy]

When Sun (self-expression) progresses into Libra (relationships) there should be a new expression of yourself in terms of relationships.


Good God! I hope this doesn't mean that I'll finally find the one 16 years from now :lol: :lol: :lol:

Thanks for your insights, Tim. Very helpful.

C1. Wow, I feel all inspiring now :!: . Astrology is full of stuff I don't understand, so I think I'll continue to inspire you for a while :D. I'm gonna check out some articles on Solar Arcs today. Get ready :idea:

[Elianah]

This may be a little off-topic, but when I work with a person's progressions, I consider them as the transformations and transmutations of a person's soul in this lifetime. The birth chart provides the basic DNA strands and the progressions, both secondary and Solar Arc, tells me how the DNA is unfolding, combining and recombining to take the person ever closer (or perhaps further away, depending on how one chooses to use the energy) to the soul's purpose in this lifetime. Unlike regular transits, which focus current energy trends into the right this moment now, the progressions are more like beyond time because they focus the energy trend of the past (including previous incarnations, ancestral patterning, and both the remembered and forgotten past of this lifetime), the present and the changeable future into a form that can be used at this moment and can and will affect the past, present and future of the soul.

I do work with both secondary progressions and Solar Arc progressions because of the nuances that they give me. For example, in my chart, my secondary progressed Mercury went Rx when I was 13 and stayed that way until my mid-30s. My Solar Arc Merc, which is not affected by retrogradation, went on its merry way. My secondary progressed Merc is on the separating orbal side of my natal Virgo Merc/Pluto conjunction in the 9th while SA Merc is slightly more than 16° into 10th house Libra. So I have both 9th/10th house and Virgo/Libra lessons to learn from Merc.

SA progressions are also nice because the planets beyond the asteroid belt don't move a lot in secondary progressions. For example, progessed Uranus has only moved 3° from its natal location in my chart where as SA Uranus is (eek! didn't realize this until now) conjuncting my MC and squaring transiting Pluto. Now there are some interesting life lessons for me. :shock: :shock: :lol:

My 2¢ worth, as always.

[Summery Joy]

That's not off-topic at all, Elianah. This is precisely what I'm asking about. I keep constructing my progressed and SA charts but I can't make any use of them because I do not know how to interpret them. I keep thinking natal! Your DNA metaphor helped as well as Tim's insights and Radu's new article. I just need to learn to think beyond the basic natal chart interpretation... And as I promised C1, here's a new inspiration coming your way folks;

If a progressed chart and a solar arc chart for the same age obviously contradict each other regarding an issue, how do we deal with that?

[Elianah]

Sore,

Remember that progressions, whether secondary or Solar Arc, are transits just as normal transits are. Where progressions differ is that they are much slower transits, especially for the inner planets.

Another metaphorical way to look at it is that progressions are the tree rings of a life whereas the transists are the weather factors affecting those tree rings during a particular year.

The weather that affects a tree ring's growth directly impacts the size of the individual ring. In wetter years there are larger rings because of more growth and in drought years the rings are very narrow or almost non-existent.

So the aspects that the progressed planets make in a chart to the natal chart express the yearly energy growth that a person has made each year and the effect is cumulative. The transits come in and highlight specific energy within the overall growth ring that need to be focused on in that moment.

Now it is important to remember that I do not do predictive astrology and I am not addressing the standard use of progressed planets as predictive tools for a chart. If you are wanting to do predictive astrology, then my metaphors probably will not work.

The important thing is that the planets, signs and houses still have the same energy no matter the type of chart. With progressed charts, just like transit charts, only the planets moves. The progressed planets will make aspects with the natal planets and the transiting planets. What the progressed planets tell us is how the person has developed, transformed and transmuted the original natal energy throughout the span of life.

The secondary progressed chart and the SA normally do not contradict one another because both will always be used in conjunction with the natal chart. They are different commentaries on the progress of natal chart heading toward the goals of the soul in this lifetime. Each commentary needs to be used in tandem with the other to enrich the understanding of how the person the chart represents has come to this present moment. In an average lifetime, the progressed elements might reach a square with the natal planets and a secondary might (but highly unlikely) square an SA, depending upon the retrogradation of the secondary progressed planet.

The thing is, with either type of progression, the size of the greatest aspect will be in unison with the person's age. For me currently that would be a 47° aspect, for you a 26° aspect. I have passed the semi-square aspect in my life and I am currently heading towards my sextile, while you are heading towards your semi-sextile aspect, progression wise.

I hope you find some value in this. :D :D

[Elianah]

Hey Sore,

Thought I'd give you (and others on the site) a chance to practice using secondary progressions and solar arcs and use me as the practice target. (Please don't hurt me too much, I'm not that big of a masochist. :shock:) It's just that I keep seeing my name appearing as the last post in many of the topic headings and feel like I'm hogging the airspace on the site. So I am now offering myself up as a sacrificial guinnea pig to atone for my hot air quotient.

So here is the relevant data for the discussion:

My angles: ASC 8° Sag 41', IC 27° Pisces 30', DSC 8° Gem 41', MC 27° Virgo 30'.

Natal planets within the angular houses:
1st— Moon 16° Sag 19' conjunct Saturn 19° Sag 43' Rx

4th — None (my lunar SN sits on the cusp of the 5th, so it incoporates both 4th and 5th house attributes)

7th — Venus 5° Can 37'

10th — Jupiter 23° Libra 48' (using Placidus House system)

Secondary progressed planets in the angular houses:

1st — Saturn 19° Sag 24' Direct

4th — None

7th — None

10th — Lunar North Node 22° Libra 39'

Solar arc planets in the angular houses:

1st — Jupiter 9° Sag 25', Lunar NN 11° Sag 57', Neptune 17° Sag 40'

4th — Chiron 6° Aries 40'

7th — Mars 19° Gem 8'

10th — Uranus 27° Virgo 3', Mercury 16° Lib 5', Pluto 16° Lib 41'

Other planets you might be interested in:

8th — Natal Sun 3° Leo 23' widely conjunct Natal Uranus 11° Leo 25', 2nd-P Uranus 14° Leo 15'

11th — 2nd-P Jupiter 0° Scorp 51' conjunct natal Neptune 2° Scorp 3' conjunct 2nd-P Neptune 2° Scorp 54'

(As I said, the outer planets don't move much in 2nd-P mode. Jupiter has only moved 7° from its natal placement, Uranus slightly under 3°, and Neptune only 51'.)

Take the info and run with it! :D :D

[wilsontc]

Elianah,

I'm a visual person so I need to SEE the chart in order to interpret it. For those similarly "data impaired," let me regive your birth data to those who might need it:
...let me give you my birth data...
July 26, 1958 3:49 p.m. CST Des Moines, Iowa...

Now, remember, you promised NOT to hit me! And I'm TRUSTING you! ;) Remember that everything I am talking about is in the spirit of TEACHING and LEARNING!

Let's start with Solar Arcs first and test your knowledge of the past! When you were 26 by Solar Arc both Pluto (transformation, also power) and Mercury (thinking, also writing/daily work) conjuncted (energy is combined with) your Midheaven. This indicates that there was some sort of powerful, transformative thinking/writing/analysis going on around the time when you were 26. Jumping into the present, by Solar Arc you have Uranus (friends, also astrology) conjunct your Midheaven, indicating some sort of outer world connection with astrology! ;) AND by Solar Arc you have Jupiter (expansion, also knowledge, teaching) conjunct Ascedant (self), indicating you are having some sort of time of personal wisdom and, perhaps, personal wisdom teaching. Neptune (spirituality) Solar Arc was very recently conjunct Moon (home, also emotions) focused in the 1rst house (being), so you recently became aware of a personal spiritual/emotional interconnection.

So much for Solar Arcs! Onto the progressions!

By progression you recently had and may be STILL having progressed (inner world) Moon (home, also emotions) conjunct Pluto (transformation) focused in the 9th house (expansion, also wisdom, teaching), indicating you may have had some sort of emotional transformation recently which experience you can use for teaching others. Also progressed Venus (relationships) recently was and still may be conjunct Pluto, so these emotional inner experiences seem to be linked to a deep awareness of relationships. Since progressed Venus is in Virgo (sign of Venus in its Fall (very challenging energy), this awareness of relationships may have been very challenging in some way. However, since Virgo has to do with daily work, there may also be the element of making these relationships into some sort of routine through transformational awareness and teaching.

And THAT is QUITE enough for a "test run"! ;)

Charting,

Tim

[Summery Joy]

Elianah,

That's cool of you. Thanks! Actually, I already had your birthdata too saved in my Astrodient account. Don't remember why and when I took it from you, but I've had it from a while now.

I didn't look at Tim's interpretation because I wanted to do this without cheating :D. I'll get on it right now.

[Elianah]

Tim,

Remember that we are also out of Mars Rx, so any anger is mitigated by experience and wisdom. ;)

Hmmm...where was I when I was 26? That had to be my soujourn into Indiana (1984-1986) when I worked at the Indiana Repertory Theatre as a public relations intern for a year and really figured out that I really didn't like theatre people (my first incarnation as a college student was as a theatre major for three years—hmm...let's play out that Aries Lunar SN in the 5th). I stayed on in Indiana for another year in a Master of Public Relations program which gave me no masters level education because it was basically a repeat of what I had at the undergrad level. I transfered back to the MA in Mass Communications program I had started out in before going out to Indiana. I received my master's degree in 1987.

Since SA Neptune has been hanging around and in my natal Moon-Saturn Rx conjunction for some time, so I think I have been sorting out my own illusions and disillusions regarding how I express who I am in public. It is interesting to note that SA Neptune is currently in sextile aspect to transiting Neptune in third house Aquarius. Hopefully the spiritual wisdom I am receiving via this configuration (as well as the SA Merc/Pluto sextile to that same 1st house conjunction) will transform how I see my role in public and not be as afraid of it.

As for 2nd-P Venus, if the transformation has taken place, it is hidden to me. Since Venus is the most inward of the planets, I may not see it clearly because of it working towards squaring my ASC.

I didn't pay attention that 2nd-P Moon is now conjuncting my natal Merc/Pluto conjunction. (Remember that I set up the exercise within the cardinal grand cross of houses. I chose that because I thought it would contain a lot of information without overloading everybody. Thus I didn't include much information for the other planets and houses except for the Leo Sun-Uranus conjunction because of its influence trining SA planets in the 1st.) I think that I am responding to that more than the 2nd-P Venus placement—although I'm sure Venus is feeding in a lot of self-worth issues into the mix because I believe it is just out of orb of that conjunction. (www.astro.com is having problems right now, so I can't get to my chart to really see where 2nd-P Venus actually is.)

Oh, before we move on, I have a correction to make. :oops: :oops: I think in a previous post in this thread I said that all progressions would only make at most a square configuration to their natal placements. That should be all SA progressions. Secondary progressions of the Moon definitely will make all aspectal relationships and most people will have at least one 2nd-P Moon return, if not two, unless death intercedes first. Retrogradation can keep an inner planet from moving much beyond its birth placement, my 2nd-P Merc is an excellent example of that. I think it is currently conjuncting its natal placement in 9th house Virgo.

Back to the disection.... :wink: :lol:

2nd-P Moon is conjunct with my 2nd-P Merc and my natal Merc/Pluto conjunction in the 9th. Emotionally transforming higher wisdom and communicating it in a personally conscious way in forms that are understandable to all, seems to be one theme here.

I'll stop here right now for I'm the sacrifice here... :D

[Summery Joy]

Hey Elianah,

Your ASC is capricorn now. Although this placement should make you more serious that your natal ASC does, I don't think there's a huge difference to you with your natal Saturn in your natal 1st house

The natal position of your moon describes someone who needs affection and offers it as well but has a tendency to keep people at an arm's length. The progressed position (9th house) shows that maybe your instinctive nature will find expression through phylosophy, religion or traveling. But the progressed moon is almost squaring ASC and DSC. I think this may mean worry about how to present yourself causing trouble in doing so. Your progressed moon is also about to square your natal moon, but I don't know how to interpret that.

Your progressed Saturn is not in Rx motion anymore. I don't what that means either but it sounds like a good thing. But it's now in the 11th house. In my opinion, this is a better place for Saturn because the 11th house is traditionally ruled by it. I guess it means that your sense of responsibility will be directed more or less towards social groups. Intellectuality will gain more importance (Hmm.. Saturn must have been there for years, so I guess this effect is not new).

The progressed fourth house cusp is in Taurus now. Steadier relastionships at home? In your natal first house, you have lilith and Pars Fortunae. That's a very difficult placement for meto understand. However, progressed PF has left the 4th house and lilith is there all alone (eek. Hope that progressed steady taurus helps).

Progressed Mars has left the 5th house and is now in the 6th. That natal position could either be really, really good ;) or really, really bad. But Mars in the 6th house has shown illness as a transit. I wonder if in progression it means the same. Anyway, porgressed mars is leaving a conj. with Algol, so I guess the effect was in fact malefic whether to daily work routine or health.

Venus is not in the 7th house anymore. Judging by its position, i bet that happened very early in your life. The natal position could give a tendency to need a steady relastionship in order to function. The porgressed position in the 9th house, I think, add to the effect of the progressed moon there. An interesting thing blew this inetrpretation right at my face when I constrcuted the progressed chart alone away from the natal. Your progressed 7th house has the moon, mercury, venus, pluto, pallas, vesta and the vertex! Very explosive. That stellium MUST be directing your energy to the 7th house issues regardless of the fact that this stellium falls in your natal 9th house. Also, the progressed DSC in Cancer shows that, contrary to yur natal Gemini DSC, your need emotional support not just an intellect and verbal communication from a partner.

Your natal 10th house doesn't have Jupiter any more. Your progressed Jupiter is in the 11th house. More friends? Better networking? Imporoved social skills? All of the above :). Your 10th house still have the North Node though so you'll continue to need to have more focus on your public liife and stop depending on your home or family or even stop blaming them for what's become of you.

Hmm. I've only done the angular houses. I'll stop blabing now and wait for you to tell me if I'm even remotely correct. I've decided not to do the Solar Arc because I'm not comofortable interpreting it like the Secondary Progressions and frankly, right now, I'm too tired to calculate arcs and openings and try to find equal ones. :)

[Elianah]

Hmmm....

The first thing to remember is that the natal planets and house configurations always remain. The progressed motions will always impact upon the natal planets/houses.

Say, for instance, that progressed ASC in Capricorn. It is coloring how I express my natal Sag ASC, as well as squaring my natal Libran Jupiter in the 10th. What are the cumulative effect this progressed placement of the ASC? I have been working on a lot of self-worth issues (since the 2nd-P and SA ASCs are in my 2nd) very tenaciously and with a single focus (Cap) to help me progress on my journey (Sag) to expressing truly who I am through the person I project into the world (1st house). The Cap flavoring has helped in manifesting the spiritual and higher knowledge portion of my journey, although the personal financial resources bit of the second has always been a challenge—I think the Sag and Jupiter, as the ruler of my chart, has always kind of trumped that.

Now you probably noticed that there is a little more than 2° difference between the 2nd-P and SA ASCs. This means the square with Jupiter (the ruler of the chart) started about 3.5 years ago and will continue until 2.5 years after the 2nd-P makes the direct square with my natal Jupiter. The progressed ASC are there to teach my Jupiter how expand in a controlled, sustainable way that will enable me fully manifest those things that the Jupiter energy wants to expand in the 10th house. Since Capricorn is the natural Zodiacal ruler of the 10th, Cap is augmenting the natural energy of it and causing constipation of Jupiter's energy, which is reflected by the square.

I'll write more tonight, if the great cable-modem god does not take down the internet again. :SIGH: But this should give some more fodder for thought. :D :D

[Claire19]

With the progressions it is just an adjunct to the natal chart. If your progressed sun is now in Virgo you may be a little more of a reader, more orderly or concerned with health matters or work techniques or everyday needs.... If it doesnt aspect any of your natal planets there wont be much effect. You are still the original sun sign and that never changes. Say your progressed venus is making an aspect to your natal mercury, if there is already an aspect between venus and mercury in your natal chart, there will be some influence. Progressions on their own mean nothing much if not triggering a natal influence of some kind. We also need the transits to back up the aspects for a certain influence to occur.

Hope this clears it up for you.


Claire

[Longleg]

Sorehearted,
I am new with this site and I looked at your map posted in 2005. I would like to know what happened in your life just then. It seems to me like you where passing through one hell of a time. Seems like you were obliged to either take care of somebody (intensly) or to manage your finance also (intensly). Seems to me like you found yourself chained down and pretty restricted. For you, being a selfcentered person and liking continuous attention from others, must have been a hard and challenging time. Fortunately is passing now.

[yelena234]

Hello Sorehearted,

I didn't thank you for one answer to me before. I do it now.

I have this year, by my birthday (April 27th, 1946 at 4:50 p.m. in Karlovac, Croatia) in Progressive Chart and also in Solar Return: Sun sextile Mars. In my Birth Chart, I have Sun (in 7th) square Mars (ruler of 7th in 10th).

What do you mean, what is going to happen?

My Solar Return shows, that I won't get the job this Solar year, but there is going to be something good for me (I don't know, what). I would like to post my Charts here, but it is difficult. About job question, there is no answer, maybe because of that, and maybe, they don't like me anymore?

I send you nice regards,
yelena (now close to Kranj, Slovenia)

[ashakamath]

Friends I am also confused about the progressions.
I learned about it couple of days ago.
originally according to Vedic(INDIAN) astrology I am aquarius-jupiter/north node and mars
taurus moon, virgo-saturn, sagi-mercury and sun and venus in capri.
in progression its coming to
ascendant is taurus 3.52d for the progression
aquarius 4 degrees-jupier 28 d, north node 26
pisces- sun 2.37/mercury 8.11/mars 18.34
aries-venus 1.41
gemini-moon 18.33
Virgo-saturn 6.04 virgo

according to my friend who taught me this-my sun and saturn is coming in to clash thats why I lost my dad- where as I felt that since saturn moved into leo on november 2 nd, I lost my dad.
he feels I would do better doing nothing for next 4-5 years. I cannot financially afford it at all and I am 56-if I sit around and do nothing for next 5-6 years whats to be done in retirement?
some one gv me some guidance.

[Claire19]

Secondary progressions only have an effect when those progressed planets hit off natal placements. So if your progressed Sun in Virgo is not hitting anything in the natal chart, you wont feel the effects really. Any progressed planets need to echo the aspects you already have in the natal chart. You are always a Leo Sun especially if you have no other Virgo influences in the chart.

i.e. Progressed Moon comes alone to square Natal Pluto with a natal Moon square natal Pluto, guaranteed issues to be dealt with in the houses affected. When a transit comes along that also hits the natal aspect, absolutely major effects felt!! Remember nothing can happen along the way that is not foretold in the natal chart. In this way it is our destiny. These progressions make for major changes that need to be made in our lives one way or another.

For instance our Saturn returns are major because the progressed Saturn comes along every 28 years or so and hits off our natal Saturn aspects, whatever they may be. They are watershed times and deeply felt. They involved maturing, responsibilities, losses sometimes and lessons learned.

Hope this helps.

Claire

[SimplyRed]

I love progressions. It is amazing how they coincide to life events and change.

I went back and researched mine and my sister's and amazed at how when the sun went into a new sign, change. A new life perspective.

Anyway, My sun just progressed into the fourth house, mercury just progressed into Gemini and pro venus is now cusp my third house. Mars is now in my fifth house.
They seem to point to significant changes as much as the transiting outer planets aspects the luminaries.

Whan I look at a chart. I note what pluto is changing, what saturn is testing, what Uranus is giving new life to. Then I look at the progressions and see where a person is with that. They work together.
Where is a person in their Saturn cycle, north node, Uranus and what house is pluto changing. How are the progressions complimenting or creating stress to work with the outer planets.
It is amazing to look at charts with a pro sun changing signs or Venus even. MC or ascendant changing signs.
I think progressions are somewhat karmic and we have choices. Life presents us with choices when the sun changes sign and we choose according to how much growth we have experienced in our life. Inner growth. I think this is where free will comes in. The natal is unfolding, and a person is given choices to work through karma of the natal chart by reacting to events or non reactive. Or be very concious of choices.

[Belgianmoonguy]

My Progressive Moon is now in Cancer (he just made a conjunction to my natal Mars and begin june '06 I had a Progressive New Moon)

It's funny... Now I prefer to just hang around with people I already know and the need to meet new people isn't so big anymore as when I had progressive Moon in Gemini...
I also select and buy more sober clothes and my behaviour is also more sober and timid as when I had PMoon in Gemini...

Also my PVenus is conjunct my nCheiron and i'm painfully aware for now of the scars ex lovers made me and the scars I handed out to ex lovers (Cheiron = wound)

My PSun & PMars are conjunct for now @ 24° Cancer and my nMercury is @ 22° Cancer

And i went to university around the time that my PSun was conjunct my nMercury in the same degree...

But for the big changes I have to wait a bit...
Around my 27, my PSun will run into Leo
Around my 31, my PRising and PMc will change into Libra & Cancer

[SimplyRed]

Moon progressions, FOR real are something else. I know what you mean

My p moon is in Scorpio and NO fun. Seems like themes of death dying reborn. Steven Forrest states this is one of the least fun places for the p moon. I loved when P moon in Leo, Libra, Virgo even. As soon as P moon in Scorpio everything is Sooooo heavy. I am looking forward for P moon to go into Sag. Right now, it is conjunct my natal Saturn and will be trine Jupiter/Uranus and then sun.
The day moon went into Scorpio, I felt it, as well as other signs.

I believe the progressions say at times more than transits, except for the hard outer to personal planets. Saturn cycles, Uranus and Pluto.

My Mercury progressed into Gemini. My P chart is wierd lookiing. A grand cardinal cross in major angles. ascendant 2 Aries, MC is 1 Cap.
Progressed vertex is conjunct my progressed Libra descendant at 2 degrees

Not use to cardinal, I have more fixed and mutable then cardinal natally.

[AquariusMoon]

I'm very new to progressions, but I can see how important it is to pay attention to them after having had tr Pluto opp pr Venus for 1.5 yrs. I really felt that, but could only see it after the transit was over. Now I have pr Desc 28 Cancer, pr Sun 28 Cancer, pr Mercury 29 Cancer and natal Uranus 29 Cancer trine natal Saturn. My boyfriend is a Cancer with natal Sun conj Uranus.

Progressions and transits do not aspect each other, only the natal planets in the chart.....So if the progressed aspects and the transits are aspecting your natal planets in a way that has an echo in the natal chart, then they are valid. i.e. say you had progressed Sun in Cancer trining your natal Mars in Scorpio and your natal Sun naturally sextiles Mars in your natal chart, for instance......then it has effect......

[Sag Moon]

I am finding that it's easier to determine major changes coming using progs.(Progressions) & SA's.

My 3 personal planets were in a stellum in the 11th at birth and each time crosses the natal asc. it effects my life.

The last to cross will be Venus using SA method and I hope it is positive change.

The reason it is so easy to see change for me is that having a 2Deg Cancer Asc. with a 2Deg. Cap Jupiter on the 7th house cusp they play off each other.Seeing that I also have Mars at 1Deg. Aries 10th the Asc. is the leg of the T-Square that these planets complete upon their move through the Asc..

To complicate that these are Aries Points which are very powerful points in the Horoscope.

In 2010 at the time my SA Venus moves over the Asc. the major AP (Aries Point)
Transits shall occur . I am giving a wide orb to this because it will be very Heavy as to the planets involved.Normally I use 3 anyway.Most use 2 degrees with AP's.

Starting June 23 ,2010 all these AP's will be really high with energy after we had gone through Pluto moving into Cap ,then Uranus will move into Aries and Jupiter\Saturn will be coming along for the ride. Aries\Cancer\Libra\Capricorn will all form a Grand Cross by transits and anyone having planets at these points will feel quite an impact.
(Saturn will not have moved to Libra yet,but it's close.)

Jupiter,Saturn,Uranus,Pluto will all form aspects to each other at Aries points and it shall be one intresting period for world affairs. Allot of upheaval will occur. I think 911 was a wake up call for what shall happen.
There might be an all out Middle East war who knows.
DRAW UP A CHART FOR 4\26\2010


Progression Charts
In the Progession Charts I focus on the faster moving planets i.e.Sun,Moon,Mercury,Mars and see when they cross any angle,conjunct or aspect a planet(mainly the Hard aspects Sq.\Opposition),Hit a major Midpoint or aspect one,turn retro,enter a new sign. Look to the outter planets also for when they change houses or one of the personal planets conjunct or aspect them.That signals big change.
Then there is great change internally to the person.Outter events can change you also so to look for the outter event through the transits.

The Moon moves fastest and it usually signals where the change is going to occur by which house it's passing through and what what aspects it's making using Progressions. The sign it's in is the feeling of the person. He\she will take on some of the character of that sign outwardly and be involved with things that rule that house.
Lastly ,don't forget the angles! When they move into new signs or conjunct a planet then that will signal something.

Orbs are tight! 1.5-2 deg. at most when applying and 1.0 separating. If you go to far then it beomes muddled in trying to pick-up the most important occurrances when they happen in these charts.

SA's work great for timing change. It's just forwarding the wheel by one yr..

Those are the things I have found through observing Progs & SA's. I just started using these a few yrs. ago and they work.I don't know weather they work better than Progs,but I am starting to see they are easier to understand when things are going to impact your life through an external event.
Infact I'd say that Proressions are the interal growth of the individual and the SA's might be considered what outside external events might produce for internal growth. They both signal change anyway.

Look to major times of change and go back to see what occured using all 3 systems. Progression, SA's,Transits to the Natal planets. I generally don't like using the Tri\Quad Wheels. Look at them individually first to see what they are doing. If after that you like the Tri\Quad Wheel methods then use them.

One more thing. On aspects I found that the Hard aspects,includung the Conjunction, will be influenced or felt more heavily then the Soft aspects. They seem to move the individual to change.

There are other systems also ,but generally not used much.

Wow,that was allot for me to think and write!

Have fun!

[SimplyRed]

Wow, Pluto conjunct moon, square sun and progressed moon in Scorpio.

I have an obsession with going to Oregon. Why, do not even know. I live on the East Coast. My life has been turned upside down and inside out. There have been so many changes in my life in the past three years, I am still trying to get a grip. People gone from my life. Two sisters I am very close to have not seen in three years. One moved to Seattle, one hooked up with a man who practices black magic. Seriously. My husband became someone I no longer knew. My Leo daughter took off with a drug addict and just now is getting her life back. She is only 20. She left him. My Scorpio daughter had a massive personality change. She went from a shy sensitive teenager to a ultra power freak. She knows POWER and uses it. She has pluto conjunct sun as well. I have a man who is obsessed with me. He is a Virgo. Wierd, a Virgo.
What else, Yea, I have gone through phone records, the works and never done that in my life. I have a Aqua Venus LOL and Sag moon. Seriously, I have done some major obsessive things. I have an obsession with wind chimes and bells. Why, do not know. Wind as well. Horses are another new gig I am currently becoming possessed with.

I have a grand water trine, pisces sun, jupiter conjunct Uranus trine Saturn.
Emotions, Too many. A Sag runs from them. A pisces falls into them.
I feel like someone is stalking me from many bizarre phone calls. Not the Virgo, an unknown. I have had 10 phone numbers in a year in a half.

This sounds like AA LOL:38: :eek:

Anger, I have shown some intense anger. Once I sent a text message to my husband and he said, the long lenthy text message made him feel like someone held him up by his neck and pushed him against the wall. I am 5'3" and weigh 118 pounds. Someone told me I use my keyboard like a 357 magnum

In intense rage I broke three old antique like things, very sentimental. Then wondered where my Pisces went went to. That is on a small amount of rage I have expressed.


Good night. Guess I am not alone.:D

[SimplyRed]

Update

After writing the above I realized that fear could be huge in pluto transits. Fear and anger work together.

I have been faced with unreal fear before in my life.

Conclusion. As soon as you fear something, it has power over you.
Nothing has power over me, not even death.

LOL, I am glad not to be a Scorpio. Hey Scorpios, nothing intended toward any of you guys.:)

I am glad to be a Pisces and proud of it.

Then there is the saying "feel the fear and do it anyway." That way you have faced it and conquered it.

[AquariusMoon]

http://www.cafeastrology.com/secondaryprogressions.html

So progressions can show evolution and can be like transits too. Having pr Sun and Mercury conjunct natal Uranus explains why the tr Uranus square Sun transit was felt so intensely and yet I don't have a natal Sun/Uranus aspect. I was wondering where this transit was coming from because I was told that if you don't have a corresponding aspect in the natal, then a transit won't be felt. All I can say is thank God that transit is over. Pr Sun/Mercury and natal Uranus in Cancer trine natal H12 Saturn and square natal H10 Neptune, oppose pr H2 ASC, so a triple transit/progression that is ongoing from natal H8 that shows a focussed study of astrology, lots of computer time, thinking outside of the box, and lots of change. I do have a natal Mercury sextile Uranus aspect. This summer pr Mercury changes signs and will sextile natal Mercury. The pr Sun and pr ASC change signs in a few years. One lucky progression is H7 pr Venus sextile natal Jupiter, which will go on for many years.

Shining Ray, I took your advice and followed my pr Moon, a fascinating exercise! The Leo Moon years corresponded with a very playful time, no work. The Libra Moon years corresponded with progressed Venus turning direct and when I looked my very best and was getting carded all the time. Red, I remember the Scorpio Moon years as being very cool, one intense time for a relationship. The Sagittarius Moon would have been more fun if only tr Pluto wasn't in Sag. The pr Moon is in Cap now along with the pr ASC, which is good for business.

[2rainbows]

my question is what is the difference between progressions and secondary progressions?

[AquariusMoon]

2Rainbows, if you click on the link I gave it will tell you. I'm new at this, so I can't explain it any better than the link :)

[2rainbows]

to all of the below, oh my!!

Wow, Pluto conjunct moon, square sun and progressed moon in Scorpio.

I have an obsession with going to Oregon. Why, do not even know. I live on the East Coast. My life has been turned upside down and inside out. There have been so many changes in my life in the past three years, I am still trying to get a grip. People gone from my life. Two sisters I am very close to have not seen in three years. One moved to Seattle, one hooked up with a man who practices black magic. Seriously. My husband became someone I no longer knew. My Leo daughter took off with a drug addict and just now is getting her life back. She is only 20. She left him. My Scorpio daughter had a massive personality change. She went from a shy sensitive teenager to a ultra power freak. She knows POWER and uses it. She has pluto conjunct sun as well. I have a man who is obsessed with me. He is a Virgo. Wierd, a Virgo.
What else, Yea, I have gone through phone records, the works and never done that in my life. I have a Aqua Venus LOL and Sag moon. Seriously, I have done some major obsessive things. I have an obsession with wind chimes and bells. Why, do not know. Wind as well. Horses are another new gig I am currently becoming possessed with.

I have a grand water trine, pisces sun, jupiter conjunct Uranus trine Saturn.
Emotions, Too many. A Sag runs from them. A pisces falls into them.
I feel like someone is stalking me from many bizarre phone calls. Not the Virgo, an unknown. I have had 10 phone numbers in a year in a half.

This sounds like AA LOL:38: :eek:

Anger, I have shown some intense anger. Once I sent a text message to my husband and he said, the long lenthy text message made him feel like someone held him up by his neck and pushed him against the wall. I am 5'3" and weigh 118 pounds. Someone told me I use my keyboard like a 357 magnum

In intense rage I broke three old antique like things, very sentimental. Then wondered where my Pisces went went to. That is on a small amount of rage I have expressed.


Good night. Guess I am not alone.:D

[astrologer50]

Liz Greene has some interesting ideas on progressions
http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_transits_e.htm

Personally I think the hard aspects are the only ones worth looking at ie; conj, squares, oppositions. Prog moon and sun to themselves or to venus, mars can suggest marriage, childbirth etc.

[Caprising]

Nancy Anne Hastings wrote the book on secondary progressions, it's called "time to remember", and is worth every cent no matter how much you pay for it!

[Claire19]

My Progressive Moon is now in Cancer (he just made a conjunction to my natal Mars and begin june '06 I had a Progressive New Moon)

It's funny... Now I prefer to just hang around with people I already know and the need to meet new people isn't so big anymore as when I had progressive Moon in Gemini...
I also select and buy more sober clothes and my behaviour is also more sober and timid as when I had PMoon in Gemini...

Also my PVenus is conjunct my nCheiron and i'm painfully aware for now of the scars ex lovers made me and the scars I handed out to ex lovers (Cheiron = wound)

My PSun & PMars are conjunct for now @ 24° Cancer and my nMercury is @ 22° Cancer

And i went to university around the time that my PSun was conjunct my nMercury in the same degree...

But for the big changes I have to wait a bit...
Around my 27, my PSun will run into Leo
Around my 31, my PRising and PMc will change into Libra & Cancer
Just out of interest does Venus natally contact your natal Chiron???
I am investigating CHiron as I am skeptical about it.

[Claire19]

Thanks everyone,

Ok. Let's take it one type at a time. Progressed first. I think I understand the concept.. in theory! I'd like some practical help. Here are my natal and progressed charts. Could you point out the major influences?

http://www.geocities.com/sorehearted/images/natal_prog.gif

If you cannot see the image, go to http://www.geocities.com/sorehearted/natal_prog.htm

Thanks.
The progressions are the planets moving outside the natal chart on the one chart. Same with transits. THey trigger off natal aspects as we go through life....So we look at the one birth chart. THis is the basis of general predicting of trends and influences.

[Claire19]

Liz Greene has some interesting ideas on progressions
http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_transits_e.htm

Personally I think the hard aspects are the only ones worth looking at ie; conj, squares, oppositions. Prog moon and sun to themselves or to venus, mars can suggest marriage, childbirth etc.
Tend to agree with the statement about the challenging aspects, the easy ones can take care of themselves.... but marriage belongs to the 7th house influences plus Venus aspects . Childbirth to the 5th house plus Moon aspects and looking at the 4th house of family as well..

[Claire19]

Update

After writing the above I realized that fear could be huge in pluto transits. Fear and anger work together.

I have been faced with unreal fear before in my life.

Conclusion. As soon as you fear something, it has power over you.
Nothing has power over me, not even death.

LOL, I am glad not to be a Scorpio. Hey Scorpios, nothing intended toward any of you guys.:)

I am glad to be a Pisces and proud of it.

T

Then there is the saying "feel the fear and do it anyway." That way you have faced it and conquered it.

Some would say Pisces is a difficult one to cope with and the trick of life is to adjust to and manage and use the birthcharts we have....after all we chose them before reincarnating didnt we!!!!:happy:

[Claire19]

Hey all,

I don't get Secondary Progressions. But before I post my question, let's make sure that I understand Secondary Progressions correctly.

A progressed chart for someone who's 20 is calculated based on a date that is 20 days later than their actual birthdate, right?

OK. If I'm correct, then what's the logic? How does this work? I was born on August 15 so now that I'm 26 I should construct a chart for .. what?.. September 10? That's puts my Sun in Virgo. I'm no Virgo! I do not demonstrate any of its qualities, the better or the lesser. Also, the ASC changes eventually.

I'm confused :?

I know there's a another chart called the Solar Arc, what's that and how's it different?
Remember not to use a progressed chart as a separate entity. It is to be used on and with the natal chart and incorporated into it for the current influences.

The Sun now in Virgo has to aspect planets that are already aspected in the natal chart......we use the birth chart always as the fundamental.
You may or may not feel any effects of the progressed Virgo sun at all.
Some of us dont use solar arc charts. YOu need to get the basic principles learned first otherwise you will just flounder. ONe step at a time. :smile: Remember nothing happens to us or for us that is not promised in our natal chart. THis is the basis of prediction...

It can get very confusing and I would get Astrodienst to do you a chart with progressions and transits for now and then you can look at it and get an idea. For instance I have progressed Sun in Libra and it is not aspecting anything in my natal chart right now and so no effects. It has in the past hit planets and caused some effect. Wont bore you with the details.

Good luck

:smile:

[Claire19]

Some would say Pisces is a difficult one to cope with and the trick of life is to adjust to and manage and use the birthcharts we have....after all we chose them before reincarnating didnt we!!!!:happy:
I agree that Scorpio and Pluto have great potential for transformation. OVercoming our fears and neuroses gives us great power and once we own them we can manage them and even conquer them. Both these signs deal with death in a major way or passing over to the other dimensions....as there is no real death.

That which we dont own, owns us...

[Claire19]

my question is what is the difference between progressions and secondary progressions?
Primary progressions are no longer used or very rarely. So when you see Progressions they usually refer to the Secondary Progressions which are the second influences on a natal chart.

[astrologer50]

http://www.artcharts.com/learn_astrology/progressed.html (http://www.artcharts.com/learn_astrology/progressed.html)

If you want to research more into Secondary progressions try here
http://cafeastrology.com/secondaryprogressions.html (http://cafeastrology.com/secondaryprogressions.html)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrological_progression (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrological_progression)
http://www.aquamoonlight.co.uk/progressions.html (http://www.aquamoonlight.co.uk/progressions.html)
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=67 (http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=67)
http://www.khaldea.com/rudhyar/astroarticles/progressionsinastrology.php (http://www.khaldea.com/rudhyar/astroarticles/progressionsinastrology.php)
http://astrolmass.com/progressions.htm (http://astrolmass.com/progressions.htm)
http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_transits_e.htm (http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_transits_e.htm)

solar arcs & secondary progressions
http://www.kepler.edu/videos/0902SolarArc/Stathis_SolarArc_Feb09.pdf (http://www.kepler.edu/videos/0902SolarArc/Stathis_SolarArc_Feb09.pdf)


The most important of progressed planets is of course, sun & moon and then upto mars, as the outer planets hardly move by progression. Now like with transits, solar arcs --- it's what these progressed planets are doing NOW by mathematical aspect to your natal planets and Angles that is ultimately important.

Also I would take this opportunity to mention there is a ‘plethora’ of information in every forum top, called 'stickys' which cover, explain in great depth what each forum is all about, plus we have an Education forum for further research..

[astrologer50]

kannon said on thread…. And I agree http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?p=349658#post349658 (http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?p=349658#post349658)


Simultaneous progressed aspects like these are more common than you think. They occur off and on many times over your lifetime.
You can go to astro.com and once you are looking at your progressed chart from the "Extended Chart Selection" click the link right above the chart: _View the additional tables (PDF)_ ... this will open up a pdf document that shows two aspectarians on the second page (progressed): one for progressed to progressed aspects only and the second at the bottom shows progressed to natal aspects.
You will probably notice at least a few of these aspects are very tight (under 0*10') for major events in your life.

I would add to this is, keep the orbs very tight, 1' approaching 1' exact and 1' departing. The aspect grid will show ALL orbs upto whatever ratio you set it....

[Claire19]

Friends I am also confused about the progressions.
I learned about it couple of days ago.
originally according to Vedic(INDIAN) astrology I am aquarius-jupiter/north node and mars
taurus moon, virgo-saturn, sagi-mercury and sun and venus in capri.
in progression its coming to
ascendant is taurus 3.52d for the progression
aquarius 4 degrees-jupier 28 d, north node 26
pisces- sun 2.37/mercury 8.11/mars 18.34
aries-venus 1.41
gemini-moon 18.33
Virgo-saturn 6.04 virgo

according to my friend who taught me this-my sun and saturn is coming in to clash thats why I lost my dad- where as I felt that since saturn moved into leo on november 2 nd, I lost my dad.
he feels I would do better doing nothing for next 4-5 years. I cannot financially afford it at all and I am 56-if I sit around and do nothing for next 5-6 years whats to be done in retirement?
some one gv me some guidance.
We need your chart. That is silly advice to give by the way... To do nothing. When you reach 58 you will have major issues to deal with, it will be your second Saturn return and what you have reaped, you will sow, even if it is karmic and from the past. Other than that I cant comment without a visual chart..

[Claire19]

kannon said on thread…. And I agree http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?p=349658#post349658 (http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?p=349658#post349658)


I would add to this is, keep the orbs very tight, 1' approaching 1' exact and 1' departing. The aspect grid will show ALL orbs upto whatever ratio you set it....
I think that with the outer planets we can use maybe 2 degrees coming and going....The issues of orbs is always debated and it is up to us to feel them for ourselves, I guess. BUt I agree no more than 3 degrees for sure..

[Claire19]

Liz Greene has some interesting ideas on progressions
http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_transits_e.htm

Personally I think the hard aspects are the only ones worth looking at ie; conj, squares, oppositions. Prog moon and sun to themselves or to venus, mars can suggest marriage, childbirth etc.
I think the challenging ones have to be dealt with and are more easily felt in an uncomfortable way....The easy ones tend to just flow and take care of themselves.'

Venus and Mars do relate to love and sex and partnerships and money......BUt where they are will tell more..