An Accidental Astrodienst Discover

[Arian Maverick]

I don't know if this is common knowledge that I remained blissfully unaware of for two years, but yesterday I accidentally discovered that Astrodienst can compute charts down to the second if you enter the desired number of seconds after the minute in the box for minutes.

For example, I have determined that I could have been born as late as 6:01:19 and have a Pisces Ascendant. Yes, the obsession continues, especially since I made this discovery the same day Astrodienst posted a new article about The First House (http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_dgfirsthouse_e.htm).

So in honor of the current transiting planets in Virgo, I invite everyone to partake in this obsession with total natal and horary chart accuracy! Every second counts, as they say... :rolleyes:

Arian Maverick

[Shining Ray]

I hate not knowing the precise time of my birth. My mum says from memory I was born around 5.30 but no later so it might be within a few minutes out. Although a few minutes doesn't radically change my chart, I still would have liked it exact. I would hate to be confused over my Ascendant although I definitely know I have a Virgo ascendant although certain parts of my life are messy (due to my Pisces planets and Neptune) I constantly talk about getting things ordered and tidy and making lists, so I definitely view the world out of this lens. Maybe looking at where Mars and Neptune are placed may help when deciding the asc. They say where the ruler is placed that is where you are, very involved in the activities of that house. But not having a precise birth time is very annoying. But then maybe I do have the right time because when I became a moderator I looked at my transits and T. Saturn in Leo 12th squared my Taurus Midheaven and T. Mars was conjuncting my midheaven so this did clearly describe what was happening at the time. Sometimes transits can help to reaffirm your time, Mars is the timer of the zodiac.

[sskohli]

hey arian,
i am using Astrodienst's ephemeris and test program for my local version of the software, so i knew the params it accepts and secs was one of it.
it is extremely helpful in horary i guess, if you have the precise seconds of when the question was asked, especially in Nadi, when the numbers can change in seconds :D..

SR,
me too i have a virgo ascendant, but just by changing the time by 2 minutes, i become a Libra :eek:, so i don't know who i am :D... i am a bit eccentric so i can be a libra, but i am organised so dunno virgo too...if only parents were more careful in noting the time :D

sandeep

[Michael]

It would be great that doctors were
experts in birth time recording accuracy,
they would need special training for that.
Due to this difficulty with natal astrology, many
get discouraged and prefer horary questions
like John Frawley, he is such a perfectionist that
it irks him to think that a natal chart is calculated
using a wrong birth time. And that's really unfortunate
because natal chart astrology has much more
potential than horary.

[ceres76]

That's so interesting, Maverick! I discovered something there today also: they show you the solar arcs in their dropdown menu. I never noticed that before!! (Jumps up and down in excitement.) It has to be said in my defense, they do add stuff every so often, and maybe this is new too.

As far as rectifying the ascendant, I always felt my degree was just a little bit earlier, but it occured to me today that aspects TO the MC, or the absence of an aspect from a particular planet, COULD give a clue. In my case, instead of the Moon not squaring the MC, I think it does, with just a few minutes of difference, and Mercury on the other hand does NOT aspect my MC. Interpretation-wise, this fits. Now I have to see if this "discovery" goes hand in hand with the Solar Arc technique of timing past events.

I am curious, Maverick, (I am new here, so I don't know about your "obsession") did you have a conflict over an Aries vs. a Piscis Ascendant?? I would think that because those two are so different, there should be clues, including physically??

ceres76

[Arian Maverick]

I am curious, Maverick, (I am new here, so I don't know about your "obsession") did you have a conflict over an Aries vs. a Piscis Ascendant?? I would think that because those two are so different, there should be clues, including physically??

The time of birth recorded on my birth certificate gives me an early Aries Ascendant (1 Aries 10) and an earlier Capricorn Midheaven (0 Capricorn 37), but if I was born only three minutes earlier than the stated time or if the clock in the hospital room was slightly fast, I may have a late Pisces Ascendant and a late Sagittarius Midheaven. I already have a first house Aries stellium consisting of my Sun, Moon, Mercury, and Venus, so it is possible that the Aries influence masks the influence of the possible Pisces Ascendant, yet it is also possible that my natal Moon's conjunction with my Ascendant may account for some of the sensitivity I feel, despite it's location in Aries.

So I have been in a kind of flux ever since, going to such lengths as attempting chart rectification and using Google Earth to pinpoint the exact geographical coordinates of the hospital I was born in to determine if this might make the slightest difference.

Unfortunately, Astrodienst does not allow one to enter in specific coordinates, but perhaps I'll accidentally discover a way around this in a year from now...

As far as rectifying the ascendant, I always felt my degree was just a little bit earlier, but it occured to me today that aspects TO the MC, or the absence of an aspect from a particular planet, COULD give a clue. In my case, instead of the Moon not squaring the MC, I think it does, with just a few minutes of difference, and Mercury on the other hand does NOT aspect my MC. Interpretation-wise, this fits. Now I have to see if this "discovery" goes hand in hand with the Solar Arc technique of timing past events.

I haven't thought of using aspects to the natal angles before; I'll have to look at my chart again and see if a slight change in time makes a difference. Thanks for the suggestion! ;)

EDIT: I don't have too many aspects to my Ascendant and Midheaven, but I thought it was interesting that using an earlier time would make most of the existing aspects have a larger orb--with the exception of the minor aspects Pluto makes to both my Ascendant and my Midheaven, whose orbs would become tighter. I've checked the Astrological symbols graphics (http://www.astrologyweekly.com/learn-astrology/astrology-glyphs.php) page to see exactly what aspect the glyphs in the aspects chart correspond to, but I still can't identify which aspects Pluto makes to my angles; I think Pluto is making a sequiquadrate (please don't ask me to pronounce it!) aspect to my Ascendant and a semisquare aspect to my Midheaven.

Arian Maverick

[starlink]

Yes AM, aspects to MC and Ascendant are mighty important in finding out more about your birthtime. But even more important to find the exact Ascendant is of course to look at Solar Arc planets making exact aspects to these Angles. You see, a progressed planet can coincidentally be exactly conj. an Angle when you marry (Venus), get a promotion (Saturn) or move home (Uranus or Moon) but they can also be 5° away from these angles to give the same result. Solar Arc, at least according to Noel Tyll, have to be exact hits. There is a difference between birth times with fast moving Suns and slow Moving Suns, so when you have a slow moving one (between March and September, must look again to know exactly) then you you have to take 1° of "making up time" into consideration. So if an aspect is exact at 17°= 17 years of age (when natal planet is at 0°), then the real happening will be a year later in the life of the person, at 18 years. With fast moving Suns, you can be sure that 17° = 17 years. Marriages, divorces are the easiest to help you figure out the exact birthtime. Also Accidents and operations and Mars,Uranus Solar arc aspects. It is always trying out over and over again until Solar Arc AND transits and/or progressions give same information. Rectifying is not easy. I also saw in the Internet (Google), when looking for JUNO and what it means, that the position of this star in relation to marriages and divorces, show significant aspects to Ascendant (mostly). I still have to look at that one. (the astrologer gave examples with the chart of Britney Spears).

[ceres76]

Starlink, how do you find out how slow or fast your natal Sun is?

ceres76

[Arian Maverick]

This is a good question, ceres76; I suppose it would be similar to determining one's mood speed (see the thread The Moon's Speed - an indicator of intelligence (http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6497)). However, to use this same method, we would need to know the average speed the sun travels in a day.

I'll do a Google search and see what I can find.

EDIT: I just remembered an easier method someone suggested on the Moon Speed thread; when you view your chart, click on the link in the upper left-hand corner directly above the yellow box--View the additional tables (PDF). You will need version 3 or higher of Acrobat Reader (http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2.html) to view the tables. Once you are able to access the file, find the number in the first row (Sun) fourth column (Speed); this is the speed of the Sun on your day of birth.

If you are having difficulty accessing this table, you can post your natal data here or send me a personal message and I would be glad to tell you your Sun Speed ;)

EDIT 2: Inspired by the transiting Virgo stellium, I've created a new thread titled Using Solar Arcs to Rectify a Natal Chart (http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?p=47230) to continue this discussion.

Arian Maverick

[ceres76]

Wow, that's pretty amazing... Sometimes I feel I only just scratched the surface of all there is at astro.com. Thanks for pointing this out, Maverick.

Sun speed is 58'2". Whatever that means.

Moon speed, while I'm at it, is 12 degrees 46". I read the thread on Moon speed. Not sure I totally agree. I think the characteristics of the Moon speed can be mitigated by other factors.

Anyway, to get back to the Sun, is mine considered slow or fast, and as far as solar arcs are concerned, if it is slow, does it mean the exact aspect has already passed before the effect takes place, and by how many degrees?

ceres76

[starlink]

Hi Ceres! I am glad AM took this one over from me! She is doing a great job there, THANKS AM!! Also for putting up that rectification with the use of Solar Arc. I am having pretty good results from that, just amazing!!

Like I mentioned above, the Sun's speed is slower during the month March through September and he moves quicker during the months October to February. A slow diurnal motion means less than one degree per day.

[bigbully20]

it seems i have a cazimi sun

[Derestanne]

Any half decently written Astrology Software program can take advantage of the fact that computers can calculate to hundreths of a second and better. Most of the Programs I've used can do this.

The problem comes with the fact that human beings are not computers. If I asked a new Client for their birthdate and they replied with, "I came online at precisely 7:52 AM and point 515 seconds", I would have to conclude either that the person is really an Android, is distantly related to Mister Spock or must have at least five planets and their Ascendant in Virgo! LOL!

Unless you have an Inner Planet hanging on a Cardinal Point in a Birth Chart and you are trying to determine exactly which house or degree it's at, then I say plus or minus one minute will work just fine, thanks very much!