France Elects Sarkozy

[unukalhai]

Radu wrote a nice piece of Sarkozy, if you haven't seen it yet, be sure to check it out...

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/astrology-articles/nicolas-sarkozy.php

Thanks Radu! Your analysis is most interesting and i didn't have his proper natal data.

I was curious, does anyone know when, as in exact time, his victory was officially declared, and/or when his term will start? I am not familiar enough with the French political system to know these things and I'm not sure where to find out... I'm hoping one of you beautiful souls knows better? :D

I had a quick look over his transits and the most striking thing was how the Uranus/Pluto midpoint is so close (<1/10 of a degree) to his natal Sun... I'm also curious how the Moon interacts as well as what angles are relevant, and that requires a close time...

The Uranus/Pluto midpoint on his Sun certainly indicates he's going to be quite the revolutionary, as this is the revolutionary cycle... Revolution enacted by pure power!

Pluto is also within a degree of his Sun/Saturn midpoint, further showing the conservative (Saturn) revolution (Uranus/Pluto) in the making. It shall be interesting to see how all this plays out; I think it's sure to be really powerful.

Regardless, feel free to discuss anything else related to Sarkozy here, the astrology of elections and political leaders is always interesting :)

[jagetoile]

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[unukalhai]

Thanks Jag! :)

Most interesting on the TNP transits, I had a look over these now and yes, they are quite powerful. I've read quite a bit about the TNPs but have not really applied them much, so I'll defer to Witte's "Rules For Planetary Pictures" for some insights into this...

MC/VU: The power and might of one's own soul. One's personal power, might and authority. The spiritual-emotional force. The personal influence. To be conscious of one's own power.

MC/HA: To be easily offended. Grief through deficiencies causes the feeling of inferiority. Business losses. To have secrets. Ill humored, bereavement and grief. To do without. Meanness. Vices. To feel disgusted. Pursued by misfortune.

transit HA is also tightly conjuncting natal VU...

HA/VU Brute force. The power of evil. Wickedness. Ugliness. Vices. Great danger. Mean and brutal acts. Capital crimes. Raw force. Murder. Slavery. Demoniacal forces, the "Dark Powers.". The evil. Power of evil. Vices, raw force. Criminals.

(Is there a positive side to this?, lol...)

transit Vulkanus is also conjuncting his natal Jupiter...

JU/VU Mighty luck. The power of money. Optimism and confidence. Benefice power. Successful power. Optimism. Confidence. Mighty luck. Success by force. The power of money and finances. Great luck or confidence. Great optimism. Very influential financial power. Credit.

Moon was also very close to his natal north node when victory was announced, with the Moon always being highly important in event charts it would seem to indicate this is part of his path; rightly so, some news articles have reported attaining this position has been his lifelong goal.

The transiting Jupiter/Kronos midpoint squares his natal Vulkanus by 2 arcmin:
JU/KR=VU To enjoy great influence through fortunate leadership. Great fortune through the power of the state. Fortunate leader of the State. Secretary of State. Chancellor.

Midpoint of transiting Cupido/Poseidon in a single arcmin opposition to his Kronos:
CU/PO=KR To accept the leadership and management of a religious organization. The state subsidized and managed religious sect. The cuts of the state.

We know he's a conservative, and many conservative political leaders have strong religious basis. I have no idea about his potential religious background, but this seems to indicate he will factor his beliefs into his leadership.

Kronos is a key indicator of leadership and authority, and is a primary consideration in this sort of thing...

I dug up some information on the 3 TNPs mentioned, figured I'd add it here so people aren't utterly confused as to the nature of these objects. I told myself someday I'd start trying to apply them, I suppose this is my first attempt *giggle*. I actually obtained a good bit of this information when transiting Uranus squared my Kronos and I ran into a Uranian astrologer who sent me most of this... Now the nodal axis T-squares my Kronos, and I dig it back up. Amusing! Cheers. :)


KRONOS (KROW nos)
Grandeur state chief authority to lead intellectually or spiritually

the high, mighty, competence, ability, authority, head of a family, renown, rank feeling, authorities, state, government, the chief, husband

The kernel formula for everything above average. The executive power, authority, mastery, ability, perfection, the professional, height.

[+]
-Mastery of socially productive skills.
-Authority. Ascent.
-High standards; Ability to distinguish quality and relative efficacy.
[-]
-Arrogance; Snobbery.
-Presumptuousness; Unfounded assumption of superiority. A "stuffed shirt".
-Elitism; Pretentiousness; Unfounded portrayal of competence. Shallow
assumptions about efficacy.

Principle: Mastery
Function: Management
Expression: Rulership, authority, position, advantage
Manifestation: Governments, bureaucracies, princely hierarchies, heads of
state, paterfamilias



[Moderator note - In accordance with the Forum's Copyright Rules, the quoted text has been pruned.]

[unukalhai]

I stumbled across this doing some google searching:
http://72.14.205.104/search?q=cache:D9MDxRzRgu0J:www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2007/5/6/150434.shtml

"Nicolas Sarkozy, 52, declared victory in the French presidential election at 8:24 PM Sunday night, in an announcement carried live on his Internet website."

Note that I have provided the version cached on google because NewsMax has removed the exact time from the article; I don't know why they did that, but it does seem the media is very weary of providing exact times for almost anything these days... Hmm :P

Anyways, using the 8:24PM time, the Uranus/Pluto midpoint shows up again, in tight square to the ascendant. Saturn/Neptune also lines up tightly with the MC/IC axis, with Mercury forming a perfect square to the MC/IC axis while sitting bang on the SA/NE midpoint. The word of the SA/NE opposition was announced, it seems.

SA/NE interaction is notable, as this election was a conservative (Saturn) vs a socialist (Neptune). I guess Saturn can triumph even in it's "weak" Leo spot.

UR/PL are in double-focus (UR/PL=his Sun, UR/PL=ASC at declaration), interesting that his term (5 years) will run until the first (mid-2012) transiting UR/PL square -- I suppose he will set up the situations and circumstances which the transiting UR/PL square relate to?

Interesting to see Sun/Saturn=Kronos in the declaration chart...
SO/SA=KR: The father. The older ruler (king).

Vulkanus seemed fairly important in this as well, interesting how it tightly squares the SA/PL midpoint at declaration. If VU = force, SA = authority/control and PL = transformation, he's really going to make some changes!

Also interesting is how the Moon configures with the ME/SA/NE t-square and drags Sun into the mix with SUN/NE=MO, while sitting on the 3rd house (communications, spoken words, as in the declaration) cusp.

Here's the chart, along with tightest aspects, midpoints and a 90 degree sort for your perusal...
http://xs115.xs.to/xs115/07192/declare.gif
http://xs115.xs.to/xs115/07192/declare_asp-1deg.gif
http://xs115.xs.to/xs115/07192/declare_mp.gif
http://xs115.xs.to/xs115/07192/declare_mp90.gif

[jagetoile]

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[unukalhai]

hi unukalhai, i think the media might be mistaken in the official announcement of the victory. in fact the result is officially known at 8:00 since 3 national chains announce it at the same time. the article might confuse it with the official discourse of Sarkozy later at the Square Concorde, he made a declaration but bit later, around 8:25 i think.


Makes sense. I guess what we'd have would be two times, the official announcement and then Sarkozy's "declaration of victory". I read another article today that said the socialist contender conceded "a few minutes" after 8pm. I'm inclined to go with the 8:24-8:25 "declaration" chart as it seems more personal to the victor, although there's no doubt the 8:00 chart would be important to, as that, i believe, also represents the close of polling.


I'm just amazed at all those points that you posted.


The chart does seem very radical, I havn't had time to analyze it fully, I would imagine there are significant midpoints and transits that don't involve TNPs which I missed, since I was focusing on TNPs... Certainly the almost-exact interaction between the angles and two important planetary cycles is nothing to scoff at, nevermind the TNP interaction if you're inclinded to use such things :)


since i know so little about uranian astrology, it will take me a bit long to digest all you wrote.


You and me both! I'm quite good at technical analysis, but it takes me much more effort to string together all the details I can pick out. Silly Virgo! ;)


just one thing about Hades, it seems that in the book of Writtes that you referred, it is not such a pleasant nice image.


Right?!


i was only aware of it "power" side since in the Greek Mythology Hades, Poseidon and Zeus are the kings of different kingdoms. for me it is a symbole of "power". my husband has Hades conjuct MC, he is never somebody wick and disgusting at all. transit Hades is now conjuct his POF, indeed he has encounterd many "dark" personalities in his work field these several years---those manipulative guys, you know. but apart from that, i don't really see the influence of Hades in the character of my husband...well, is it possible to indicate that he had business with hospitals during most years of his career?


From what I've read about the TNPs and their interpretation in Uranian methology, the "simple" aspects are barely used, with the primary analysis coming from midpoint pictures on the 90 and 22.5" dials. The other thing that stands out from the bits I've read is they aren't really very active unless indicated by several factors. Many of the Uranian analysis of events and other various charts tend to focus on deeply integrated midpoint relationships, and basically ignore "simple" aspects unless they play a role in a larger geometrical context. It certainly is a much more complex system than I've yet to grasp, although it seems it would "reduce" to mere geometry if I could wrap my head around it all..

You might try looking at you and your other's charts on the 90 and 22.5 degree dials, the exact method depends on what software you have. I prefer to use Solar Fire or Kepler for this, as both offer midpoint sorts in the 90 and 22.5 degree modes, which is the clearest way to go lacking specialized Uranian astrology software. Aureus puts out a "Special Uranian" program but I've yet to obtain a copy, and finances say I won't be doing so any time soon... hehe. The 90 degree midpoint sort with the Uranians included seems to be the place to start. This will show you the midpoint pictures in which the Uranians interact in your chart. I'm still trying to understand mine! Kepler can also provide transits to midpoints including the 22.5 aspects. You could also use Astrolog32 in the 4th (90 degree) and 16th (22.5 degree) harmonics to look at the midpoints of a nativity, although midpoint transits (in any mode) are very difficult to extract from Astrolog32, unless I'm just not aware of the proper way of doing so.

If you don't have software to provide you with a proper midpoint sort, I can produce the sorts for you in the same manner I did for the Sarkozy chart above.

I should also note I did NOT include a full TNP sort for the declaration chart, only some of the more interesting TNP midpoints, as a full list is quite large and does require some picking through to get the real important stuff out.


is Hades concerned with hospitals?


I have not read any such thing, but I'm not exactly authoritative on these subjects! <giggle>


how do you distinguish Hades and Pluto, in Geek, they refer the same thing i think?


So true! But, I did find this which offers a little insight to that question...

from: http://finblake.home.mindspring.com/jphades.htm
Asked about how it compares to Pluto -- Pluto is more active, more about will, and the pursuit, use and abuse of power. Hades has no personal component to power and abuse like that.

Check out the rest of the series from Janis Page, most interesting!
http://finblake.home.mindspring.com/jptransnepmeds.htm

The root page has some useful information as well, if you haven't found this one yet, the "Uranian Beacon", probably the most extensive English-language Uranian site I've found... Although it seems heavily geared towards selling their "Special Uranian" program.
http://finblake.home.mindspring.com/UranBeacon.htm


i was wondering how much orbs you use for the TNPs? with the midpoints involving them? yes i've discovered the TNP and midpoints with amazement.it's incredible how these inexistent planets could tell us the things...


To my understanding, 1 degree or less, however others may disagree, I'm certainly not the ninja of the TNPs! I think on the finer dials, like the 22.5", you would stick to 1/2 degree. I'll try to find some more authoritative information on this :)


thanks for this information of TNPs, i looked in the forum and very rare information was discussed until now, you know you are leading something very interesting here, hope to share more with you, best, Jag:)


You're welcome! :) Thanks for bring up the Uranians, weird they'd come up like this, maybe we should start another thread for it all, but whatever the case... Don't let us Uranian-geeks stop you all from discussing other factors of Sarkozy! :D

I'm not sure I'm leading anything, but certainly stumbling over the rocks of my own lack of knowledge as I go ;) Maybe at the best I can convince myself and maybe even others to study the TNPs more; I'm still far from sold on them myself, but hey... I started studying astrology to disprove it and ended up kicking myself in the butt, so you never know, maybe I'm repeating the process with the TNPs.. <lol>

My major "holdups" on Uranian astrology has been the scarceness of information coupled with what I perceive as an elitest attitude from some of the Uranian astrologers I've spoke with or read writings from; I understand new techniques are important but so are classical techniques that are still valid; I repeatedly seem to perceive the tone of "those silly people still using those old techniques" radiating from the Uranian folks, which tends to miff me. I suppose if I was a master of Uranian techniques AND had a big head, I could follow suit, but.. I lack the former for now and hope to never acquire the latter!

As far as the objects not physically existing... I think it's way too early to say that. First off, we're just starting to acquire the technology to see that far into the Kupier belt/Oort cloud/Scattered Disk, and second, I don't think any scientist in his right mind would want to mention finding one of the Uranian TNPs; to do so would give some serious credibility to one of the most controversial facets of astrology, a subject most the scientific community despises with a passion anyways. Can you imagine the flurry of amazement if one of these objects was located?! I'm not trying to argue they do exist, but rather saying I'm not willing to say they don't exist... I wouldn't be surprised if one or more is made known physically in our lifetime, but I'm not going to be holding my breath nor consider it a probability. If one was located, it would seem a firestorm to locate the other 7 would ensue.

My other thought on the TNPs is that they could in fact not be real objects, but resonance points of existing planetary objects. Who's to say these "orbits" are nothing more than harmonic points in existing planetary cycles? Considering they are most active in midpoint configurations (ie: interacting with other planetary cycles) it almost seems vaguely logical.

Also interesting that even astronomers use the term Transneptunian to describe KBOs, plutinos, scattered disk objects, etc, and consider them all to have an orbital resonance with Neptune.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuiper_belt#Classification_and_Distribution

Ah well, enough speculation :)

[jagetoile]

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