do i have a serious health problem?

[milkywaygirl]

hi all,..........

[AquarianEssence]

You didn't say what your symptoms were, but it looks like your body is trying to communicate with you. Mars, ruling the 6th is in foreign territory, being peregrine. Moon, ruling ascendant, is also peregrine. Usually Moon is more comfortable reflection Leo's light from her 12th house position in Cancer. But here she is reflecting the other guy's light. She isn't in hard aspect. She just finished a sextile to Mercury ruling intercepted Gemini in the house of chronic illness, also the natural ruler of health through Virgo. Her only active applying aspect right now is semisextile to Mars, ruler of the 6th. Moon, you are in the house of other people's stuff, with Mars manifesting that, communicating for the other person. She will oppose Saturn but that is a ways off. She is going to sextile Jupiter, the other rulere of the 6th. Other than the opposition to Saturn, she only makes harmonious aspects while in Aquarius. I wouldn't worry at all.

One time I had a strange sensation in my left arm. I knew my body was talking to me about something. I assign the left side, being a woman, to the masculine side of the family. Looking at the arm as the whole body, I saw that the pain was in the heart area. Immediantely I wondered if my dad was ok. He found out a couple days later he needed surgery, a stint in his heart artery. Sometimes, I look at the symbolism. If the eye is acting strange, what do I need to see? If it's my right eye, how might it involve Moon issues (for a woman), or the left, the Sun, my dad? Eye sounds like I. Could I need to pay attention to myself for a change? Once I discover the message of my higher self, the symptoms disappear. It's not always that easy. I've been working on arm nerve symptoms since 2004 that aren't resolved yet and just keeps getting more mysterious. Yes, there are a few people that have a lot of nerve and I lose my nerve sometimes, too often. I'll figure it out eventually.

[AquarianEssence]

You're welcome. Which two fingers? Right hand, I assume? I'm wondering if you have a transit, progression or arc going on in the Northeast quadrant of your chart, especially the 3rd house that may involve the Sun somehow. Nerves and hands are Mercury mostly. That could be siblings or something that is being said. Gums I'm not sure about. They hold your teeth, ruled by Saturn, used for chewing, pondering in preparation for assimilation. The back is Sun or the past. Itching, anxious for something? It makes you scratch, dig into something, missing the spare in bowling. Craving some alone time as a result, good time for digging into something, pondering...

Thumb and first two fingers are median nerve with possibility of repititious work causing a narrowing of the wrist passage way. I see the message from the median nerve being one of the middle road, moderation. That is the best cure and prevention for median nerve problems. Thumb represents will, Leo or Aquarius? Index finger, the one we point with is Jupiter and the longest finger is Saturn's. Right side is sowing, masculine but I suspect the opposite for women. I always gave my babies protection and comfort on my left hip. When I hug I tend to have my left arm higher than the right even though I'm right handed.

Ring finger and little finger are Ulnar nerve, usually with problem stemming from elbow or shoulder impingement. Sun and Mercury rule those fingers. See the word "should" hidden in shoulder?

[astro.teacher]

This chart should not be judged, the Ascendant is too early and therefore to early to be judged (literally). Ask again at a later time.

[AquarianEssence]

Hi Astro Teacher. I've noticed, in reading some of the works of the traditional fathers, that they don't always follow their own "rules". I read this chart as saying she is in the infant stage of learning to read her body. The chart is radical, as Jupiter rules the hour and is exalted in Cancer, also placed in the 6th house of health. Jupiter is the teacher. I've even read charts with Saturn in 7th, just keeping in mind the limits that are placed on me, the reader. With an early degree, on must keep in mind that more information will come available, more developement will take place. But I don't think it bars us from reading it if the chart fits the question. If so, then we have to throw out the rule of not asking the same question twice. I don't follow that one either because I believe the universe is a patient teacher and will tell us in a different way if we don't understand the first way it stated the answer. I have to rephrase things with my children sometimes. Just my 2 cents. (or is that scents or sense? :))

[astro.teacher]

I dont believe Jupiter being exalted in Cancer (and of the Hour) makes the chart count as "Radical". I believe it needs to be House specifically when matching this up (someone feel free to quote me a line from a traditional author which states this and I will be more then happy to concur but im fairly positive its only House). I was just trying to save the readers some time. Many argue back and forth whether the Radical rules are important but really, they are just a means in which to save the reader time from reading a chart they usually wont understand. But rules are important not only for saving the readers time but for illustrating that charts (of questions) not ready to be read, shouldnt. Will you get a correct answer? More times then not its very easy to get a correct answer probably because there are far to many people open to believing whatever someone tells them when it comes to Astrology so it may present itself as correct even if the reader is way off (im not judging anyones reading ability, just in general I find this tends to happen). At any rate in straying from the main point. If you wish to read this chart by all means do so, however you should be cautious, especially being about health and wellness.

[archergirl]

I would agree with astro.teacher. Two degrees is too early. The moon is also in very early degrees. Being in the 8th house only shows us that you are fearful. Technically, it is void of course, as it has passed its last aspect and does not apply within the orb of another planet for many degrees.

You have stated that you are under stress ('working like mad'), and I would say that stress is a bigger killer than many more 'serious' conditions, because it wears you down slowly until you are unable to fight back.

If you *do* look at the chart, it tells you this. 6th ruler (health) at the MC of 'career'. Ruler of MC, Jupiter, retrograde in 6th of health. Health is in career's sign. They apply by square.

If you are concerned about your health, it is probably more sensible to go to your doctor *first*, and *then* ask a horary question. ;)

Like astro.teacher, I would suggest you wait this one out, get some rest first, see the doc, and then ask again at a later time if the symptoms don't go away. Escaping on a solo trip shouldn't be considered as blowing your savings, but as a life-saving endeavour. If you are in hospital with stress-related illness, what good is that money doing, sitting in the bank? Go for it, I say. But I'm a Sadge, so of course I'd say that!

Best wishes,
AG:)

[AquarianEssence]

William Lilly writes, on p.121 of Christian Astrology:

... the Question then shall be taken for radicall, or fit to be judged, when as the lord of the hour at the time of proposing the Question, and erecting the Figure, and the Lord of the Ascendant or first house, are of one Triplicity, or be one, or of the same nature.

Both Cancer-Moon and Jupiter-Pisces are wet through ruling water but I guess Jupiter is given the quality of being hot and Moon being cold so if so, then they don't quite match in being the same nature. That doesn't really make sense though since the ocean is quite cold, small lakes, Cancer, are warmer, Mars puts fire in Scorpio and the mother's breasts are quite warm producing warm milk.


Christopher Warnock says, "My experience is that a radical chart which contains this sort of sympathy between the rising sign and hour ruler is accurate, but that the lack of radicality does not mean that a chart cannot be judged. The true test is how well the chart describes the situation. Physical descriptions derived from signficators can also be useful in validating a horary chart."

While I value and respect the teachings of the traditional astrologer's I also understand that they viewed the world differently than we do now because we have discovered, learned and matured. What was called evil we can now view as a challenge to be overcome and learned from. Take a square for example. In horary it always means no but the parent's place or our cozy home is not possible in relation to the self without a square. We cannot give love (the trine) to our partner without an opposition.

Milkywaygirl, by all means, if your body is telling you that you need a professional medical opinion, get one. I was only trying to show you how to listen to your body and sharing my experience in reading this chart. And, please let me know what you learn. If this chart truely isn't fit to be read, then I want to know that. But, if that rule has authority here then what do we do with the rule that you aren't to ask a question twice? Are we not allowed to ask our higher self certain questions? I would never except that. The God/Goddess I know would never leave the child abandoned without guidance. With my children I form guidelines that fit the situation. As the situation changes I change the guidelines, having less as they mature.

[archergirl]

this is really worrying to me because my career is very intrinsicly (sp?) and intimately related to my health right now. bad health for me right now = no career.

In which case, reducing the stress in your life is of utmost importance. Your quality of life is far more important than *any* career, whether the chart is radical or not. [intrinsically ;) ] But the Moon is VOC in your chart: nothing will come of the question. You still have Free Will to change your life.

AquarianEssence, some might view the fact that the chart says 'not fit to be judged', as a form of guidance from God/ess. Self-understanding doesn't come from receiving a constant stream of answers from somewhere else. Sometimes it comes from being disciplined enough to live without an answer!

I'm not sure I agree with the viewpoint that modern interpretations are 'mature' versus traditional astrology being 'immature'. Horary astrology was already very old when Lilly wrote his books, and very well-tested. There is no reason why one can't combine the ancient fundamentals with a more modern perspective, but some things just work without having to put a different slant on them, and I feel traditional horary rules fit this.

The considerations of radicality in a chart are just that: considerations, and even Lilly didn't comply 100%!

Best wishes,
AG:)

[AquarianEssence]

That's good, I'm sure it will help deal with the stress. I can see this also, in the chart. Venus ruling the mental health is at 29Taurus, the degree of weeping over Atlas' having to bear the weight of the world, clearly stress. Please give us a follow up.

I have to make one point about the common definition of Moon void of Course. The first thing most people say is that nothing will come of it, as was said above, but that is absolutely NOT true and we must retrain our thinking in this area. Moon was void during 9/11 and many other very important events so we can not say that nothing will come of those times. It is clearly a time when a veil is put in place or lifted in order to accomplish what otherwise might not be accomplished. I haven't been able to get the responses to this thread out of my mind and I have begun doing more research into events occuring during voids. I will share when I've finished. When I've brought up 9/11 with others trying to hold the usual view, the only response is that the ones flying the plane were following sidereal rather than tropical zodiac so it didn't count. That seems a week answer to me. If any system works, it works regardles of other's beliefs or practices. Another way some try to dismiss the void is through out of sign aspect, which still is compromising the definition. The tropical zodiac position even fits Osama bin Laden's likely natal Moon position if he was born around 7:30 am. If a perceived "truth" proves to be not true then it must be redefined. The only reason things will fail to come to anything is if something is overlooked, ignored or missed. The plane certainly didn't miss.

Milkywaygirl, sending you light and love. May you feel better soon with full understanding.

[archergirl]

The first thing most people say is that nothing will come of it, as was said above, but that is absolutely NOT true and we must retrain our thinking in this area.

I would strongly, but respectfully, disagree with this. There have been thousands upon thousands of charts done where the VOC moon signifies that nothing will come of the question. That isn't to say that there aren't other ways to intepret VOC moons; it is highly contextual and in one chart it will mean 'nothing will come of it' and in another it will mean 'you have to wait before taking action'. But to put an absolute on *any* definition in horary is to block out a huge area of it. There are so many reasons why the traditional interpretations *still* work, and changing definitions just for the sake of change or for something called 'modernity', is treading on dangerous ground, IMO.

Best wishes,
AG:)

[AquarianEssence]

My reasoning has nothing what so ever to do with modern vs traditional. It is based on my observation over and over again. It is almost always true that things don't turn out as normally expected but rarely true that nothing comes out of that moment in time, whether its a question being asked or an event taking place. I agree that there are various alternatives to the meaning to void of course, wether Moon or another body. But usually only that one choice is given, "nothing will come of it". This is what I disagree with. While it may be true, it often isn't, as our continued conversation shows, long after that void is over.

Respectfully,
Connie

[archergirl]

Hi A.E.,

It is almost always true that things don't turn out as normally expected but rarely true that nothing comes out of that moment in time

I do see what you're saying, but I think some caution should be taken in interpreting 'nothing will come of it' too literally. Of course, *something* always comes of nothing, even if it's not what was expected. But 'nothing will come of it' within the context of a question means, simply, that the question *as it stands at the time of asking*, is invalid for whatever reason; in this querent's case, 'nothing will come' of her fears of a serious health problem. Stressed out? Definitely. Cancer? Not very likely.

It may come down to a semantical argument, like 'what is "is"?'; it may also be simply a difference in worldview, e.g. how complicated do you want your horary answers to be?:p Most people understand and are happy to settle for 'nothing will come of it' without too much further thought: they get the idea, it answers their question. Whatever works, I say!

Best wishes,
AG

[starlink]

Hello Archergirl, Astroteacher and Aquarian Essence! interesting discussion, I just saw it (because I was looking for the 1st post of Milkyway).
Regarding the early Ascendant, I always look to see if the chart could be interpreted based on other valid reasons (Lord of the hour, a very important planet in the Birthchart of the querent making an aspect to the Ascendant of the horary chart etc.). I have had one very good result lately with an early Ascendant, giving a date which turned out exactly right for someone who desperately looked for work. So I do think that with an early Ascendant, there is room for interpretation at times (sure, not always).
Secondly, that Moon is, I think, not VOC. It just entered a new sign and it will conjunct Neptune and after that squaring Venus at 29° before leaving the sign. Maybe, in the case of an early Ascendant in combination with a VOC Moon, it is than valid to say that there is not yet enough information on this question or not everything was told by the querent about that question.
Milkywaygirl is clearly worrying (Moon in 8) and nervous (Moon in Aquarius), and this is stressed by (already gone) square from Pluto (co-significator of the 6th) with Mercury (burnout), but apart from that I also do not see any mayor healthproblems. co-significator Jupiter, the great benefic in the 6th in own sign about to make a trine to her Sun.Maybe going on vacation is the answer!