Jupiter opposite/square Saturn

[Lissa]

Good morning everyone!:)

Well,this is an aspect I personaly have(the Jupiter-Saturn opposition happens to be the most exact aspect in my chart)and that gets me very puzzled.I'm not interested in the role this aspect plays in my chart,but by it's simbolism and the meaning behind it.I mean,both Jupiter and Saturn are the largest planets in our solar system,and their very essence is so different I can't help wondering what would it mean when this two giants are in conflict.

Jupiter represents growth,faith,optimism,expansion,the wave of good luck we all want in order to achieve our goals with little(if any)effort at all:) .Saturn is completely the opposite-hardship,struggles,isolation,and even bad luck-all the things we don't want!Although I do believe that all the struggle and delays Saturn creates do lead to growth and success in the end;through hardship,we grow,and what doesn't kill us is exacly what keeps us alive because it makes us stronger.

I can't really understand what are the implications behind the conflict of these two.I collected some opinions on this and did some research,but would like to hear other opinions so I can understand it better.Also,what would the difference be between the square and the opposition(I know the square shows a point on internal tension and with the opposition the tension comes from the outside,but I'm just trying to understand the difference in the opposition and the square between these two).

Just for curiosity,you can find a list of all the Jupiter-Saturn oppositions since1901(the site goes back in time to the early centuries but I thought this were the more significant ones)here (http://www.astropro.com/features/tables/geo/ju-sa/ju180sa/JU180SA6.html).

All the best,
Lissa

[Lissa]

Hi Fullmoon,

Nice to hear your own experience with this aspect.I have this one too-with a8"orb(lovely:) ).I'm so intrigued about this aspect because it doesn't seem to affect me at all:confused: .Being such a tight,tense aspect between these two powerful planets,and being the AC/DC axis involved(considering also that Saturn is my chart ruler),I would expect it to create me a good deal of problems or to manifest itself in a very powerful way but no,it seems like the aspect is just sitting there:) .I've read several descriptions of it and I simply can't relate to none of them:confused: .The only one I could relate to was Bob Mark's description-in his website,he talks about one of hsi teachers who had the opposition too,telling his teacher would say something one day and say the opposite the next day.Contradictions-that's what my life is all about:) .I say one thing and change my mind five minutes later,but I feel like that's more related to the interaction between Mercury and Mars in my chart.I'm very familiar with the conflict between the need to take care of our obligations and be mature(Saturn)and the need to have fun,to act childlike(Jupiter),but that's just the typical teenager conflict so I don't give it too much attention.I feel like my Moon/Mercury conjunction,trining and sextiling both planets,must play an important here,perhaps like a channel for the planets to express themselves(and Venus making an out of sign t-square with both planets must play a role here too).

I have to say most of my astrological "studies" revolve around this aspect,and I've been collecting different opinions about it's simbolism in order to reach it's deeper meaning.Some of the things I've heard:

-That the aspects brings"limited expansion",because Jupiter expands and Saturn contracts(well if one expands and the other contracts I guess this means we stay in the same place lol);

-That the aspect is connected to outlaws and people who live on the welfare and do nothing to contribute to society(I have no idea how the person got to this one:confused: );

-That the aspect is a sign of mental disorders such as bipolarity;

-That the person is seldom aware of how the aspect acts because it is more unconscious;

-That the aspect limits one's chances for happiness and makes life kinda "boring",because Jupiter stops Saturn from causing major damage but Saturn restricts Jupiter's natural expansive nature-the result of this is that the person is basicly protected against major disasters and suffering but the chances for happiness are also restricted.

Blessings,
Lissa

[kiwikid]

I have a Jupiter-Pisces-7H opp Saturn Rx-Virgo-1H opposition.

Had to laugh Lissa :D when you mentioned people who live on the welfare. I had a heart attack Xmas '02 which damaged my ticker and now live on a sickness benefit. Mother & G.Father died of heart attacks, I got lucky.

AND my brother has bipolar depression. His Saturn Rx at 29deg Leo on 4/5H cusp, his Jupiter 1deg Aquarius, so more of a Quincunx degree-wise but opposing signs.

For me the Saturn limited + in worrier Virgo = tend to keep my problems to myself. It was stress building up inside that blew my health. The opposition is 3 deg orb and I don't feel the opposition much. Probably because they are in mutable signs - swinging from one to the other is no big deal. Jupiter is also conjunct vertex. Very lucky, but can get really burned as well. I've got Sag on my 3rd and 4th cusp, 8 brothers and sisters, lived on a farm - lots of freedom, in fact still living on the same farm.

Feel confident when with people I know, but had to learn to approach people I don't know. Think that's the 1H/7H thingy. They say oppositions have to do with your relationship with others, balancing the needs.

Sorry I can't be of more help
Cheers
Marg :)

[Lissa]

Hi Marg!

Sorry to hear about your current health condition:( .

Like I mentioned before,the1st and 7th houses are also involved for me(Jupiter in the7th,Saturn in the1st),and I could relate to what you said about learning how to approach people you don't know-I feel extremely anxious when I'm around strangers,sometimes even around people I know,I simply don't know what to say,it's simply like my brain freezes,I just didn't think this could be a expression of the Jup-Saturn opposition:confused: .The bit about Jupiter/Saturn being related to mental disorders may be true,since both bipolar disorder and schyzophrenia run in my family.

It's always nice to hear other's experience with this aspect;) .

Many blessings,
Lissa

[wintersprite1]

Hey Lissa

An opposition is much easier to deal with than the square. The opposition is an extreme on the same theme where as a square is like trying to appease two different entitys within one's chart.

The thing to remember is that the energies supplied in the opposition do not blend and form a new energy. There is dipping back and forth, with one side sorely missing when the other is active. With the opposition taking place in the 1st and 7th, this will be the most evident for you in relationships or partnerships and the view you hold of yourself. Jupiter will be optimistic and giving and Saturn pessimistic and withholding. When being open and sharing with others, you will feel a tug that somehow there is too much given by yourself and you should be cautious. When you are more stingy with others, you will feel the tug you should be more open.

Look for the midpoint between these two planets to find the focus point. When you feel you are pulled in two directions, remember the midpoint and try to apply those energies to the situation. You mentioned having a T Square to Venus from these two Planets. This is much more important to focus on than the opposition. The Tsquare will be one of the midpoints. Knowing that it is Venus, the suggestion is for you to work on unconditional love and the appreciation of the beauty that surrounds your life. When Jupiter is saying... " I am putting you on a pedistal" and creating images too large for the average person and then Saturn is saying, " You are suppose to be this and do things this way" and placing unrealistic expectations... this is when Venus comes into action and says, " You are perfectly you and I accept that." The signs and houses in play with this aspect should give you more of a clue on how things play out.

I do not have this particular opposition, but do have a Sun/Moon opposition in Cap/Can in the 12th and 6th. In nearly every relationship I have had, the partner has a Cap Moon. This in itself creates an imbalance and my Cancer Moon is activated into overtime. I have a Tsquare to an Aries Jupiter and I find that is where I have my "me" time. I particularly find that most non intimate relations I have are with Libras and Aries and these are my most carefree and enjoyable times.

Hope this helps out some,

TK