13 constellations, not 12?

[TKay]

http://spaceplace.nasa.gov/en/kids/st6starfinder/st6starfinder2.shtml

?

[Kaiousei no Senshi]

Yes, this is all very much correct. Thanks to Procession of the Equinoxes (the skeptics biggest debate card) the planets are not in the Tropical, or even Sidereal signs they are said to be in. Thanks to this procession, another constellation has entered the fray, Ophiuchus - or Serpentarius - now is home to the Sun from November 30th to about December 18th, I believe. This will change as the procession increases. However, this is about as detrimental to astrology as the reclassification of Pluto.

[Pisceanfool]

There is a common misconception among skeptics that the stars themselves refer the the sign. While this is somewhat true, this was originaly developed thousands of years ago when the "fixed stars" where in the preceeding constallations anyway. There is, however, little change in the interpretation of the various signs over the years. The point is when we say "Sun in Aries" it refers to the position of the planet in relation to us on the fixed backdrop of the stars. So i really dont think there will be much change however the new stars could vibrate different energies to us (depends really on your view of how astrology actually works).

[lilllybelle]

Quote however the new stars could vibrate different energies to us (depends really on your view of how astrology actually works).Quote
Now that's an interesting idea. Has anyone heard or done any research into the qualities of this 13th sign?

[Kaiousei no Senshi]

Serpentarius cannot have a personality. One of the main ideas behind astrology is that the sky is divided up equally into twelve parts, these twelve parts are the signs we have now. Since 360 cannot be divided evenly by 13, Serpentarius is out of luck. However, one may speculate that this is the lost dignity of Chiron, as Asclepius was a healer who learned how to defy death.

[TKay]

Thanks a lot for the feedback..

The chart says that Cancer would actually cover July 21 to August 9th...

So, if you were born August 4th, would the traits assigned by western astrologists to Leo still be accurate?

[Kaiousei no Senshi]

Yes, the sign of Leo would still hold domain over your personality. Astronomy is not astrology, they operate on two completely different levels. It's best they stay seperate.

[TKay]

Yeah.

I was in a debate with a very rigid person who called the tropical zodiac a joke and said that the traits were assigned to the wrong dates and signs.

I’ve noticed that I do reflect the Cancer to some extent and my Aquarian sibling has quite a few Capricornian traits.

I was curious to see if there was any truth behind his rantings.

[Kaiousei no Senshi]

Yes, it kind of is a "joke". Using it still works, but, technically, that's not where it is. The Sidereal system is, perhaps, a bit more reliable, as the signs are backwards one, currently. A Sidereal year operates differently than our years, it's only about twenty minutes longer, but the twenty minutes adds up over so many thousands of years which explains the difference. However, the Sidereal system has its flaw that it doesn't include Serpentarius and still follows that ever-important "sky is equally divided by 12 signs" law.

Now, why the Tropical system works so well is beyond me, but creating a Sidereal chart for myself most of my planets move back one sign. There's no way that much Cancer can be indicitive of my overtly Leonine personality.

[Belgianmoonguy]

So I'd be a Gem Sun
What a surprise
Well, I think you can only clearly differentiate between them (Sidereal & Tropical) if you have a lot of planets in one sign and don't have planets in the signs after and before that one sign...
Gem does kind of work for me, but i have a Gemini Midheaven, and Virgo on the rise (and Virgo Moon)
So Mercury is very powerful in my western tropical chart...
So the Tropical/ Sidereal thing will always confuse me... As a Sun/ Neptune, i'm easily confused

[AquarianEssence]

We are very complex beings. 13 can be incorporated into our consciousness if we choose. Look at the historical 13s that have influenced history, King Arthur, Jesus, just to name a couple. Perhaps we can incorporate this, perhaps, more realistic view of our place in the universe by seeing the 13th being where our Sun truly lies representing the self with Self fully embodied. Then we can say with Jesus, I and the father are one and we will be able to remove Excalibur from the stone.

Just a thought ;)

Connie

[enigmas]

Is it true that ophiuchus is between scorpio and sagitt? That scorpio sign is long only 7 degrees and the rest is ophiuchus?
What planet would be his ruler?

[Lupus0]

Is it true that ophiuchus is between scorpio and sagitt? That scorpio sign is long only 7 degrees and the rest is ophiuchus?
What planet would be his ruler?
Eris. Both are quite immortal amongst the zodiac. Eris is Goddess of chaos. Chaos never dies, and Ophiuchus is a sign of immortality.

[Ophiuchus10]

Eris. Both are quite immortal amongst the zodiac. Eris is Goddess of chaos. Chaos never dies, and Ophiuchus is a sign of immortality.

Could be. Both Eris and snakes seem to have a thing for applessss.

[enigmas]

does anybody knows smoething more about him...for example how to intepret if you have planet there?

[LoneStar]

A search of the site reveals several other threads with some info if you are interested:

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/search.php?searchid=113348

[tarant8l]

There are 22 zodiacal constellations, 15 for the sun, which enters Cetus and Orion. The number of ascendants varies but it is 16 for the epoch at hand. The meridian constellations poise a more complex problem.

[Pisceanfool]

The way i see astrology it has much more to do with numbers then stars. The signs are divisions of the 360 of sky into 12. Astronomy is not astrology. We don't choose to incorporate 13, 12 is a numerological value. The only reason we have various "aspects" is based on numbers and thier numerological values. Numbers are everywhere. Astronomy is not astrology.

[vox]

Both tropical and sideral zodiacs only take 12 signs into account; however, a small minority of sideral astrologers include all 13 constellations.