Need urgent help please - Money missing

[balefully]

Dear Astrologers,

Need some help with this upsetting matter. A buyer has contacted me to buy my artwork and after receiving the payment notification from paypal, I sent the work over but when I tried to withdraw the payment from paypal, I received a notification that the fund is missing and the account is freeze. I'm really upset over this. .... .... I need the money so badly and I thought this buyer is a gift from God who will help me through. But it looks like a possible fraud now! I've tried to reach the buyer but he has not respond to my emails and MSN till now.

Does the chart says anything about receiving the deserved payment successfully? Is this person a cheat? I hope someone can help me with this...


http://img113.imageshack.us/img113/2606/moneyxp1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Thanks with luv,
bale

[balefully]

Edited this post to add additional comments:
-----------------------------------------------
When I first did the chart, I have not spoken to the owner of the paypal account nor the person who bought from me. The chart is made after receiving a notification from paypal that the fund is unauthorized and freezed in my account. I received an email from the owner of the paypal account claiming he didn't autorize the transaction and then I managed to get hold of the person who bought from me.

I'm utterly confused by this situation. There are two persons, one claimed to be the owner of the paypal account and another is the buyer whom I have conversations with to sell the work. The owner of the paypal account insist that he didn't make the payment and the buyer said he does. I don't know if they are the same person or different persons and i don't know which to believe. is there any clues from the chart? and will I be able to claim back the money?

Appreciate any insight and input.

Thanks,
bale

[balefully]

After spoken to two persons, one claimed that he has already made the transaction and another claimed that he didn't authorize the transaction but the payment is sent and clear and he wants to commence legal proceeds. The problem is I didn't receive the money in hand. I've spoken to the paypal account owner and he claimed that it will be best I return the money to him. The whole situation is being turned around as if I'm the person who is lying and cheating. I don't know if the two of them is in cahoots or to believe in which one. I know I'm not the first or will be the last to experience this paypal fraud..... But isn't anything else I can do to detect the cheat and get back what I deserved? I've filed a claim with paypal and I'm anxious to know the outcome. Will I be able to catch the culprit and receive this sum of money?

Interestingly... I've realised it is another VOC chart.

Any insight please?

anxious, frustrated, upset
bale

[fensi88]

You have so many questions. Pick up the most important question for you and tell us the data for that question or post chart.

[balefully]

Hi Fensi, thank you for the help. The most concern question is if I'm able to receive the full payment and the first chart is done to ask what happened to the money and if I'll be able to receive the sum of money finally?

[fensi88]

I do not see chart you talk about, post chart or data.

[balefully]

Hi Fensi, the chart is actually attached in the first post but anyway I have PM you the data.

Thanks

[fensi88]

ASC at 8Vir41
You are Me at 10Cap42 , ruler of 1st house and Moon at 13Can19.
Their money is Ma at 20Sag20 , ruler of 8 house.

Is there applaing aspect between rulers? No
Is there collection of light? No
Is there translation of light? No

So the answer to your question is "no", you will get no money. There is only one sign for possible "yes" answer, but I would not count on it: The almuten of 8 house (their money)is Su, but its strength is smaller than strenght of Ma, and as you see, Me, you, will conjuct Su for about 2 degrees (weeks), and that could be "yes" answer, but as I said that is very optimistic.

[Summery Joy]

Bale,

I'm very confused here. Please tell me exactly how you phrased your question when you first ran the chart. That is, the part that you have cut off the chart to keep your infor private, what quesion did you have up there?

Also, do you have any related event charts? Like when you were first contacted by the buy or when the account owner first claimed he/she didn't authorize the tranaction.

Last, it's not a half bad idea to have the account owner pursue legal action. It will be very clear that you didn't get any money, so no one will be able to hold anything against you, and, you may actually find out the truth about this.

[virgo96019]

Hi Bale, who is the owner of the paypal account? I don't know if I can give astrological advice, I'm just as confused as you are, but the reason I ask is because we had our paypal account frozen when we were in dispute with a buyer on ebay. When an account is frozen money can be put in but not taken out (we had already withdrawn the money before it happened) If the buyer is happy with the art and paid then the issue isn't with him but the paypal account owner. Paypal can track all transactions but I'm not sure how they handle the 3rd party thing. Save all emails. If the paypal account owner withdrew the money there will be a record of it, If he is having a problem with the account he has to take care of it before they will unfreeze it. Are you saying he wants you to send him money back that you never recieved? I don't know but it sounds very fishy.

Virgo

[balefully]

A sincere big thanks for your help on this. I have to apologize I was full of anger, frustration, confusion and fluttered by the incident. I didn't able to explain the situation clearly and properly. There were too many questions racing to get into my mind at split seconds and I really wish I could find the answers immediately. I was just as confused as the situation is.. But after a recollection of mind and analyzing the situation.. Here is what I gathered.. It is confirmed a fradulent attempt but there is one thing I wasn't very sure if the paypal owner and the buyer is actually the same person.
I'll share the details here as I hope people can learn from this lesson and be more careful of dealing with transactions using paypal.

I'll give the names of the characters involved for easier explaination. The paypal account owner(PAO) is the one who owns the paypal account. The buyer(BY) is the one who has contacted me about my artwork and purchased it from me and the one whom I have sent my work over.

The whole scenario is this..

The (BY) contacted me and expressed an interest to purchase my work. We had a conversation via MSN and he made the payment immediately on the same day.

I received paypal email notification that the payment is already in my paypal account and the payment mode is instant. It means it isn't paid by credit card and the money is already clear to my account. So, I delivered the goods to the (BY) immediately because he needed it urgently.

And I did a withdrawal of the money to my personal bank account. And almost hours later, I received an email notification from paypal saying the withdrawal can't be processed because the payment has been withdrawn by the (PAO). And I received an email from the (PAO) that he doesn't authorize the transaction and have cancelled it and he insisted a full refund from me.

I contacted the (BY) a couple of times but he isn't responsive to my msg until I have told him I did got hold of the IP address. As a matter of fact, I did have the IP address logged. He responded claiming he is ignorant of what I'm accusing him and he insisted he has made the payment. The conversation turns ugly and as I requested the (PAO) to verify with him together on MSN. The moment the (PAO) signed in, the (BY) logs off.

A conversation is carried with (PAO) and he claimed that he didn't authorized the transaction and someone accessed his paypal account illegally.

The issue is... Though he has claimed that he isn't aware of this but he doesn't express any concerns or urgency with someone access his account illegally. He has claimed that there are unauthorized transaction of his accounts and this is not the first time it happens to him. He insisted on a full refund immediately and I'm not worried of this because I believe Paypal will look into this matter as the money is really not cleared.

I'm suspecting both of them could be the same person who wants to get my work and also money from me or they could really be two individual persons and the (BY) did access the (PAO) account illegally to carry out transactions.

The (PAO) has tried very hard to convince me he is truly clueless of what is going on and he is also a victim. The whole situation is being turned around as either I'm cheating him and have to return the sum to him or he is really innocent that he doesn't authorize the money and he didn't receive the goods.

I'm not worried on the issue of me having to pay the money because I believe paypal will be able to solve this problem. The major concern I have is if I will receive the money of 1000USD that is due to me and I need to know if the (POA) and the (BY) is the same person or they are two individuals who don't know each other.

The first chart is done instantly after paypal sent me a notification telling me the withdraw is freezed, I was anxiously asking if the (BY) will pay me the money. At that point of time, I have not received the email from the (POA) claiming a full refund nor spoken to either of them before the chart is done. Neither did I know there are two seperate identity. Hence, the first chart is asked with the concern if the (BY) will clear the payment due. And I was also wondering what happened to the money and why is it missing from my account?

Shortly after, I managed to got hold of these two identities which I happened to receive email and MSN from both simultaneously and after a conversation with the (BY) and (POA), I was very confused and angry with the whole incident.

I am sure I need not pay the 1000USD as paypal will have records of this and hence my new concern is if I will received the payment made and if the two identities are in cahoots or they are really two seperate individuals.

I believe the (BY) is concern of the IP address that I have logged and that is why he signs up to MSN and respond to my msg for verification which he acted innocently and then abruptly leave the conversation when the (POA) gets on the MSN.. I suspect they may be the same person using the same desktop and hence there is no way both of them can be in MSN at the same time.

I don't know if the first chart is enough to get clues on this situation as it was done before I am aware of what happened and before I am aware of there are two seperate identities. And there was many questions floating in and out at the same time so I don't know how to identify each chart for a seperate question.

From a horary point of view, is there any clues or ways that I can get the answers and know the outcome from it? If the culprit will be caught and if I will get the payment.

And after getting a clearer understanding of the situation without getting too emotionally involved, I have this strong desire to know if I consult legal advice and pursue this, will justice prevails? I don't know if it needs a seperate chart for this question.

I hope anyone who has used paypal to make transactions will take into more measures to protect themselves from fradulent cases. I'm aware i'm not the first and won't be the last, so don't join me in experiencing this after you have read this.

Any insight is appreciated. Thanks for the help given.


Thanks with luv,
bale

[balefully]

These are the event charts:

First chart -- The event timing that paypal sent an email notification to inform me a payment is made to my paypal account by the buyer. I'd assume the notification is sent almost immediately after the purchase is made or the least a couple minutes lapse.

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/2693/buyertg8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


Second chart -- The event timing where the (POA) first emailed me he doesn't authorized the transaction and requested a full refund. I immediately MSN the (BY) and let him know I have already logged his IP and need him to clarify the issue. And almost 10 mins later, I got a MSN respond from the (BY) who claims that he doesn't know what is going and insisted the payment is made and the conversation is very ugly. I really feel like slaping him if he is in front of me.

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/7594/ajv0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

I have all the timings recorded as the conversation and transaction is through MSN and emails, I will be able to provide any event charts if needed.

Thank you for the time taken and appreciate any input from it.

With luv,
bale

[balefully]

ASC at 8Vir41
You are Me at 10Cap42 , ruler of 1st house and Moon at 13Can19.
Their money is Ma at 20Sag20 , ruler of 8 house.

Is there applaing aspect between rulers? No
Is there collection of light? No
Is there translation of light? No

So the answer to your question is "no", you will get no money. There is only one sign for possible "yes" answer, but I would not count on it: The almuten of 8 house (their money)is Su, but its strength is smaller than strenght of Ma, and as you see, Me, you, will conjuct Su for about 2 degrees (weeks), and that could be "yes" answer, but as I said that is very optimistic.

Thank you fensis! The chart is done with regards to the possibility of the (BY) will clear the payment and why is the money missing because I was clueless of the whole situation at that point of time. Will it be possible this chart shows that the (BY) identity is not going to make the payment or it means an overall negative chance to receive the payment that is made via this transaction?

with luv,
bale

[Summery Joy]

Bale,

You still haven't said what the exact phrasing of your horary was.

Let's see if we can work with the event charts alone.

First chart – notification of transaction

Capricorn rises. Normally, this is good for business. But in this particular case, Cap on the ASC makes your significator Saturn Rx in Leo in the 8th house. This is an incredibly weak position for Saturn with major debility both essential and accidental. Your customer is ruled by the 7th, their money by the 8th. Your significator is debility there is not a good placement. A perfect placement would be the significator of the 8th in your 1st or 2nd houses showing that you have their money. In this case, it shows that either they have you or you messed up in debt. Saturn also rules your money because it rules your 2nd house. This placement could show you owing them money, not the other way around.

The significator of your customer is the Moon. It has major essential dignity by being in its home, Cancer. But it has accidental debility in both the radix and turned charts by being in the radix 6th and the turned 12th.

Saturn anti-receives the Moon because the Moon is in Saturn's detriment; i.e. you don't really like your customer!

I don't see much signification of the transaction being successful. I don't see Saturn, the ruler of the 1st and 2nd in any kind of beholding with the rulers of the 7th and 8th, the Moon and the Sun respectively. I don't even see translation or collection of light, which would be descriptive in such situation with some sort of mediator between you two (the internet websites and paypal and all).

The Moon as a natural significator of the event is applying to an opposition (problems) with Mercury, the natural ruler of communication. It will soon apply the Sun, the ruler of the customer's payment. The final lunar aspect is an opposition (problems) with Venus (the artist) in the 1st (you) with the Moon being in the 7th (the customer).

Obviously the chart is not good for the event of a successful sale on any other transaction for that matter. But I honestly can't see that I see any evidence of the customer being a fraud or a con artist.

Second chart – customer denying transaction

This chart can very easily read as one of them "is the rumor true" horaries. The only problem is that the chart should be constructed for the day, time and location of the customer because they were the initiator and the one telling the news. You don't happen to have this kind of data, do you?

It's just that this chart shows them as a liar. All the angles are mutable. The Moon and the rulers of the angles are not fixed. The cusp of the 3rd is fixed, but its ruler is mutable. Even if we consider the turned 3rd from the 7th, we find the cusp fixed and ruler not fixed. We need more fixed signs that this for a statement to be true.

BUT, this chart was constructed using your day, time and location, not theirs.

Please tell me if you have this data and please, please tell me what the original phrasing of the horary was.

[virgo96019]

Darn , I just lost my whole post!...I hate that. Well anyway believe it or not I still have questions. Who is the owner of the paypal account that the money came out of, is this someone that the buyer knows? Where did he come from? Did the buyer not have his own account? or were you unaware that this was not the buyers account? I feel this is important because it would determine the relationship between the buyer, the account holder and you, I am not sure what to use as a significator for the account holder. If I have this right you already have your money, maybe you'll have to pay it back? In the first chart you posted, there is an opposition to your significator from "them" moon in 11th house, and the seventh house ruler is jupiter, we already know there is something fraudulant going on here, Jup sq uranus in the 7th, but receptive to the moon in 11.....I think I'm afraid to go back and check or I'll lose this post too. It is possible that the 2 are the same person but it is also possible that the account holder is clueless. This is the libra in me coming out here. Either way it all goes back to the buyer and if the buyer is giving you attitude instead of working with you to clarify the situation, than it is obvious he is guilty of something.

Virgo

[balefully]

I lost my post too. Had typed a detailed post of the update but it is lost!

I'll keep this post short in case it is lost again.

Sorehearted,

The exact question is : Will the (BY) pay me the money?

Thank you for the event chart reading.

The first chart is when I received notification from Paypal. The money is in my account and hence I sent my work. So, it is right that the money is in.


The 2nd chart is when the (PAO) denied he has authorized the transaction. From the chart, it does mean he is lying. And the (BY) and (PAO) is actually of the same person.


----------------------

Update:

Paypal has closed the case and reverse the money back to the buyer within 36 hours the claim is open. And Paypal has never asked for my verification or contact me to find out what's wrong. They provide a short sentence telling me the access is unauthorized and the case is closed. I, the seller, who have lost the item and money do not have a chance to state my case. My account is deficit and I'm liable for the fee incured. I could not close my account and have to top up money to restore the negative balance. I can't remove my bank details either. And Paypal is able to deduct fund from my account without my consent.

I've emailed Paypal numerous time to ask for verification what they have done to justify the case. What are the steps they have done to justify the access is unauthorized. There isn't any reply from them in the last 48 hours.

I've done a search and realised there are millions of similar cases like Mine. It explictly shows that the cheats are taking advantages of Paypal inabilities or lack of attention to counteract the fraudulent attempts. The (BY) who said using Paypal is the stupidest thing has double proof that he is taking full advantage of the loopholes deliberately.

I am utterly digusted by the way Paypal handles this matter. I'm going to file a case to sue Paypal and the Buyer.

Being rich and influential doesn't give them the right to led the poor by the nose. They have to get what they deserved and I have to get what I deserved.

Thank you for all of your help on this. I've done a chart asking if I will win this case. I'll post it up after I filed and keep you posted of the outcome.

Thanks with luv,
bale

[Claire19]

Dear Sorehearted

Can you post your natal chart and we can look also at your progressions and transits.

I dont ever conduct business on the internet, it is too unsafe. I never use bank accounts or anything at all. The hackers can get in anywhere, anytime and the institutions will never tell you how many millions are defrauded.

I hope to be able to enlighten you once I can see your chart.

Claire

[Claire19]

Sorry, I think I addressed the wrong person in this issue.

The person looking for lost money, can you post your natal chart please?


Claire

[Summery Joy]

This looks like a no. I don't see any application between Mars (BY's money) or even Jupiter (By themselves) and Mercury (you) or Venus (your money).
Mercury combust is not a good sign. I guess you were the victim of a scam.

I'm sorry. I wish you could deliver better news. I hope I'm wrong though. I tend to get confused doing horary charts when tr Mercury is afflicted or in detriment.

[balefully]

Hi Claire,

Thanks for the help in advance.

There is the natal + Transist + Progression..

May I also take this chance to ask.... what is the black dotted line in the chart?

http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/9731/natalcx2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Thanks,
bale

[balefully]

Sorehearted,

I'm filing a legal action tomorrow. Hopefully everything turns out well and every involved parties gets what they truly deserved.

Thanks greatly for your help and time!

With luv,
bale

[Claire19]

Now I am looking at your chart re the money missing. DO you mind me asking how much it was and what for? I am right in that Paypal was involved on a net transaction?? I will now look at the legalities section of the chart. I dont use fixed stars for natal and certainly not for transits. Many do. I like to keep things as simple and clear as possible.

Cheers
Claire

[Claire19]

I will say that you have a badly aspected Uranus in 11th and in Scorpio. This can mean underhanded tactics with corporations and large businesses using the modern technologies such as the internet. I would never again allow myself to do transactions this way. I dont as I trust no one especially on the net and you have such challenging aspects in this way which will operate all your life.