Channeling or analysis?

[Radu]

Just a thought that passed by: this is important - and I'd like to know what you think about it: do you do natal astrology reading as if it were some kind of channeling or do you think it is more of an intellectual effort?!

I mean: when reading a natal chart, do you try to perceive (from above or within, or elsewhere) some flow of inspiration about that natal chart or is it just technical chart interpretation by the book. If both, what is the proportion of each? What is the importance of each in a great natal chart reading? Which one makes you a good astrologer? ..... and many other similar questions. Just answer these for the moment ... :)

Thanks!

(it's great to be here, among so many passionate astrologers and wonderful people)

[wilsontc]

Radu,

My approach to astrology is that it is accessible to all, once they understand how the chart fits together (possibly by using my site http://www.geocities.com/wilsontctc ;) ). Once they understand the right/left, top/bottom of a chart, they find themselves knee deep in astrology without realizing it! ;) From there, it is simply a matter of continuing to divide up the chart, until they are finally looking at the houses themselves. And if they get THAT far, then they are well on there way to becoming an astrologer. The rest of it is INTERPRETING the results...but the person whose chart it is can do that FAR better than the astrologer! ;)

Too often astrology sites display the RESULTS of an analysis without giving the person the parts of the analysis that made up that result. I say...give people the pieces and let them create their OWN analysis. After all, astrology is ruled by independent Uranus, so our astrology should help people become independent as well! ;)

Preaching a word-based approach to independent astrology,

Tim

[Radu]

I wasn't referring to beginners, actually I was thinking at intermediate level students of astrology, such as myself. To be more clear: I wonder how important is the intuition when reading a chart. For instance, yesterday I did a natal chart delineation for a friend and found myself trying to give a good reading by using some kind of intuition like: what does it mean in this case the Moon square Mercury, being part of the mutable T square, with the Moon in the 3rd house and Mercury in the 1st... There are many elements to consider, and a description of each of them apart is something that any astrology software or website can do, but putting it all together is very different, that requires a human operator.
This is not "psychic astrology" (staring at the chart without prior astrological knowledge), as without a good knowledge and understanding of the meaning of each planet in signs/houses, aspect or configuration, it cannot be done. I'd rather name it "intuition-enhanced".

This was actually the nature of my inquiry, I'm sorry I didn't put it into clear words.

So, any help?

[wilsontc]

Radu,

In my opinion, when a person looks at a chart and tries to "intuit" what a chart "means" they often are often simply channeling their own experience into someone else's chart. Instead of trying to figure out what it means, the astrologer should say something like, "You have this type of aspect in your chart, which indicates some type of tension between this and this. How does this tension work in your life?" By posing a question, rather than imposing an answer, both the astrologer and the other person learn through the process.

If this also not what you meant, let me know and I will refine my reply further. For this is how we learn! ;)

Learning from asking,

Tim

[Radu]

I like this! It seems to be a good approach, I'll give it a try next time.
Thanks!

[Lapis]

Very important and interesting questions. Questions that I personally have battled with over the years because I am naturally psychic. Because this word, this term has become so degraded and changed over the past 20+ years I'd like to clarify what I mean exactly when I say "I am a natural psychic".

I see, hear, sense, physically feel, emotionally feel energies/images/events/Beings/past lives/dimensions etc. that most don't. (But this is changing super fast kids :wink: Most everyone is MUCH more psychically aware today.) This is a huge and complex, multi-leveled subject just like astrology so I won't get carried away with explanations about it here.

For 17 years I was a dancer. What this means is that for a few years I struggled to physically learn steps and movements. Not choreography but individual dance steps and movements etc. Then I spent another couple of years getting good at effortlessly and spontaneously putting them all thogether in my own unique ways. And last but not least was the hardest part for me - performing! After another year or two I mastered this aspect of 'Dance' and now I was actually getting good! :wink: The last phase of all of this was my hard earned ability to use both sides of my brain at the same time. :shock: I'd mastered the physical, the technique, the left brained side of it all. Plus I'd finally mastered the emotional, psychological, artistist, creative, ancient, esoteric or right brained side of it all.........and this I feel is what makes an excellent Dancer/Performer. A body and soul dancer.

Same is true with Astrology I feel. Excellent Astrologers will be the more whole brained people. Those who've gotten a REALLY good understand of all the basics (left brain) ......... PLUS those who learn how to also use the other half of their brains, their very Beings and can see, sense, feel, know, intuite, all the other levels (right brain). Put this together and I feel we will have current day Astrologers that are getting very close to the ancient Astrologers. Remember that in the 'old days' Astrologers where usually well versed in both what we'd today call 'science' and 'esoteric' or 'occult' wisdoms as well. They were far more whole brained people than we are today, sadly. (Again, this is changing very fast.)

I'm the first to admit that I have the opposite problem that most do with Natal Chart interpretations......I sense first! I have to force myself to as I say, "Sit n' stare" to see from my left brained side. See what's there technically, physically. Now, here comes the real hard part! After I feel comfortable with the technical side of the natal, I then try to discern (right brained side) the soul level of the person. Why? Because with this knowledge I now know if I SHOULD go deeper, go farther into my psychic nature to receive some information for this particular person.

Many years ago I quit doing Natal Charts and interpretations for people only because they wanted to know every day 'normal' things and I was giving them past life, karmic current life, deeper soul level info. Both of us were frustrated and disappointed in the end! So I backed off and quit. It wasn't my time yet.

This post is long already but if this is a subject that others would like to discuss further (I sure would!), then I'd love to go into more details about this process of accessing other aspects of ourselves in order to see into Astrology (and more) even farther. http://img322.imageshack.us/img322/9210/rainbowface1xf.gif God knows I learn from all of you who are so much better at the aspects of Astrology that I have trouble with.

[Radu]

Yeah, I particullary liked this "whole brain astrologers" idea, this is great, this must be it. I'm not psychic, although I can "feel" some things.

Astrology training SHOULD include "whole brain" sessions such as "alpha state" or "silva mind" training or other similar semi-meditative techniques.

Thank you Lapis for your post. Very helpful.

[Waterbearer50]

Radu,

After an almost 20yr. lapse of study I'm just getting up to speed on my chart reading. In fact I'm in the middle of looking at a chart of a non-family member for the first time in 20yrs..
My approach is Transformational.First I look at the 'power trio' by sign and house in a by the book approach, but then my intuition,psychic sense takes over and a sense of the" being" comes. So for me it's 50/50.
I agree with Wilson that everyone of us is best suited to read their own chart, for nobody can know us better then ourselves.


Lapis-Ireally like that "whole brain" Idea. :)

WB50

[Radu]

As I'm thinking on it, I realize that the entire Sky Vault may have its projection on our (entire) brain cortex area with all the gyri and sulci following the principle "As above, so below". The sky is a map, the brain is a map, the astrological chart is a map.

All are 3 dimensional spheres (astrology is tridimensional as declinations are important as well).

I wonder if there is further application of this idea... Like considering the nodal axis as the central fissure that separates the two emispheres and trying on reading based on that or considering the grey matter as the ecliptic band, and the planets out of this band as having an influence that cannot be easily understood or other similar "abberations"...

Cool

8)

[Lapis]

Yes....holographic. We are individualized aspects of The All That Is and because of this we do have constant access to all that is! Problem is that for the most part we don't really believe this. Add to this the fact that for the past few thousand years humanity has successfully been contained within only the left side of their brains. Its good to ponder why!

Much of humanity wants answers to spiritual, metaphysical, and paranormal questions but they search with only their 'left brains'. The left brain won't get us there! We each can access our 'right brains' and connect with many of these answers ourselves. And when we get more familiar with using BOTH sides of our brains, we become so much more of what we are naturally. I feel that so many (maybe all?) of the current transits (now - 2012) and especially the Galatic Center conjunctions are pushing humanity towards this 'healing' within our brains, our hearts, our spirits. We need to become whole beings to function in the Age of the Cosmic Man.....Aquarius.

Here's a great and very easy visualization that will help to consciously reconnet you with your 'right brain' and MUCH more. After you've done this a few times it will be so easy to see and to FEEL, to internally visualize this image that you'll be able to do it in a few seconds. Really SEE this in your minds eye.

************************************************** ****

Stand facing East and with your eyes closed strongly visualize a line of light energy coming from the East and entering your heart and passing right through and flowing all the way out to the West and beyond. Really SEE this line of light energy from East/West conneted through your heart.

Now do the same thing and strongly visualize the line of light energy coming from the North and again connecting at your heart and flowing right through to the South for as far as you can mentally SEE. You are now connected, anchored to the 4 cardinal directions and energies.

Next, while still holding in your minds eye these 4 directional energy light lines passing through your heart, send another line of light energy straight down from your heart through your spine deep deep down into the Center of the Earths core. SEE this and feel how connected and anchored you are to the Earth's Center and the 4 directions.

Next, from your heart send another line of light energy straight up through your spine and head up out and far, far up to the Galactic Center. SEE this and feel how you're both connected to the very Center of this Galaxy AND at the same time connected to the Center of this planet, Earth. How you're connected to the 4 Sacred Directions also. Now feel how large a Being you really are! You are both physical and spiritual at the same time.......and the connecting lines all come to YOUR HEART. SEE the 6 Sacred Directions all connected by these lines of light energy through your heart. The last step is to SEE yourself from your HEART because this is the last, the 7th Sacred Direction!

*******************************************

After doing this visualization a few times you'll really feel different, and you'll never get lost again! Your sense of direction will be amazing. Also visualize the geometric form that is all around you connecting you to everything from your Heart. Happy Visualizing everyone. :)

[Buai]

Nice thread Radu...thank you

I would like to put a few ideas to you all.

Here goes...

"WE", or our nervous systems, ARE (like) computors, biological ones, relative to us, but "Intergalactic" ones, relative to our purpose and potential as Cosmic Beings.
That's how time travel etc occurs. (ever been out of body, or in 5D?)

If that's true, (?) it implies that our nervous systems are in fact potentialy tuned, "with awareness" (I'll define this in a minute) to the "Galactic Impluse", and it's up to us (if we so desire) to clear our "mind channels", (Mercury) or nervous systems, so as to be open to the "connection and flow" of Light info'. (Uranus)
In a profound way, it is our divine right and responsibility to allow that to happen, it's how we are working out "Unity" and reconnecting to God.
Why else are we here? Especially right now... 2012 IS (potentially) THAT!
Make sense?

"As above, so below" implies possibly more than we are aware of.
...There is an amazing book written by Rodney Collin - 1954, called "The Theory of Celestial Influence".
It's kind of Astro Physics. Bit intense, (I'm no brain, believe me) but well worth the read.
In that book he explores and describes the harmonic relationships between the Cosmos, and our own microcosm.

See, every cell, molecule, atom and nucleus etc in our being, is LITERALLY an EXACT mirror of the cosmos.
The distances that relate them, the masses, speeds of movement and orbits etc, of our Solar System (in fact, Planets, Galaxies and beyond) are an EXACT mirror of our "internal system" regarding the distances, masses, speeds of movement and orbits etc, of our own cells, molecules, atoms and nucleus' etc.

Bearing that in mind, by virtue of harmonic resonance, "WE ARE" at one with the "Intergalactic System>S".
We ARE the Cosmos...no mistake.
This is how the Planets so intimately affect us individually - "Harmonic Resonance".
Our very own personal connection to the Divine.


Ok, put all that in context with being an "Astrologer", and you get quite a heady mix.

Just 100 focussed Monkeys... :idea:
Doing what we do "collectively", (for long enough), is helping a great deal to evolve that "Unity" for all, through nourishing and developing an intimate relationship with our "Unbounded Intergalactic Selves" (WE ARE Intergalactic, "WE ARE THAT") because of where we focus (first), and (then) allow our Selves to expand out to, (and into, same thing) ie. "Eternity".

I agree with you Lapis, first we learn "steps of dancing and rythm" (the language of Astrology), then we learn to mix it up (research, explore and play), then we perform (apply and share that experience to help show others the way). It's showtime!!

What is "Channeling"?

Is it not the "allowance" of Cosmic energy to connect to "source", through our nervous systems, unimpeded by the "Intellect" or rational mind?

There is NO MYSTERY, there is only the "unknown and yet undiscovered" (or UN-remembered, all the same thing).
There is only one true "Mystery and Miracle"... it's a **** "Miracle" we can maintain this present separation from source, (God) and it "seems" to be a "Mystery" as to how to unravel this "Miracle" We "maintain". :P

So, I think "Intuition V's Intellect" is not really relevant anymore, one leads to the other, and then they both work as one.
The energy is much freer these days...if only we can get out of our own way and allow "it" to happen.
We are poised to evolve past that distinction > 2012 - Pluto cnj GC first, then our "system" cnj GC in Sag will transform the way we collectively "believe" our world is perpetually dying and being recreated.
Our world is an "agreement" that we shall soon collectively "transform" our "minds and Selves" about. :lol:

I always saw it like this...a body of knowledge (for a philosopher or Astrologer in our case) acts like a vehicle, it takes us on a journey, (a little closer to Self) during that being applied and integrated, (IF we allow) it gradually transforms and evolves into a finer body of knowledge, that takes us deeper into the journey, and on and on, to cosmic perception, beyond the mind and intellect. ie. NO judgement...just pure perception of "name & form", (same thing, again! nama & rupa, if I remember correctly) at the Soul level.

"IF" we hold on to the intellect, (a particular body of knowledge) and refuse to let go (trust) and flow with Spirit/Love, towards a finer and finer connection with the Planets/Gods, (same thing) through the Heart, we wind up back at the "Bus depot", having fallen asleep before we arrived at our destined stop, to get off!
(Fear of the unknown?)

"Collectively" we have been fast asleep on the bus, while it goes round and round and round, dizzying isn't it? But we are now waking up :wink:

... and look, here comes our stop again!!!
Lets get off this time, and go explore where we were always destined to be.
Bustop "Planet SELF" :D ...same thing.


:arrow:
Personally I find it hard to "stay with the Intellect" when I read.
Depends on how I'm feeling at the time though of course, and what is required.
I learned through dreams, the pictures associated with that way of learning has become my "general" way of interpreting the chart.
I tend to feel/see them. 12th house I guess...Plus 20 years of meditation and Yoga.
I sometimes like/try to share what creates the interpretations,
(Tim-wilsontc :D ) but that seems to interupt the flow of impulses, I can forget entirely where I was, or what I was saying, and that can be frustrating for both.
Unless someone specifically asks "how", or it comes "to mind" to share it, I don't share that much of the "how" anymore.

I also would like to empower everyone with this knowledge, but I generally read when I read, and teach when I teach.
For me, I find it better to keep the two separated. Or I get lost in the cross purposes of what is needed at the time. And very little is completed as a consequence.
If you can combine the two, nice1. :wink:

"I think" :wink: during and after learning and becoming very familiar with the "language of Astrology", (doing a zillion charts) learning to silence the mind is a step in the right direction.
Astrology is a path, let it lead the way, and be at peace with its/your unfolding.
There is no Mystery. So there need be no fear...

I hope this isn't too disjointed - I have a long way to go myself. But I trust these ideas may shed some light on this topic.

Thanks everyone for the great input :)

[Lapis]

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/2872/rockon9wz.gif Buai. Thanks for that! Delicious......

I remember one night long ago my sister and I sitting at the table around 2 AM, pondering some of the BIG QUESTIONS. One of these was, "What do you think the new Age of Aquarius will bring?" We sat there questioning, laughing, talking, scribbling things on paper. I scribbled out Aquarius' glyph and was staring at it when suddenly I saw/understood a bit about our question.

I told my sister what I'd just recieved and it went like this:

We've (humanity) been the upper part of the Aquarius glyph ^^^^^ (meaning the time period of the Matriarchal/right brain 'rule' and development and learning phase etc) and we've (humanity) been the lower (second row) part of the Aquarian glyph ^^^^^ (the Patriarchal /left brained 'rule' and development and learning phase etc).

During the Age of Aquarius the focus is in the seemingly empty space (not even!!!) inbetween these 2 rows of frequency! These 2 rows of polarity. The 2 halves of our brains. The PHYSICALLY empty space inbetween is where humanity finally resolves its seemingly unending battle with duality, polarity! We are supposed to transition into this space, this reality, this consciousness where we (humanity) evolve back (please notice I said back) OUT of Duality and into Unity.....The 2 reunite and instantly birth a 3rd new 'thing' vibrating far beyond the realm of Duality. That 3rd 'thing' is symbolized by the Cosmic Man-Aquarius.

Humanity will resolve this illusion of duality, integrate the polarities, and become what we all are in the first place. Cosmic Beings.

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/2686/popcorn9cg.gif

[Radu]

Thanks for these posts!

Lapis, again, I am delighted with your insight - this time on Aquarius glyph. I'll be thinking about it.

May I challenge you to express what you think on the Pisces glyph ? :P

:idea:

[Lapis]

Radu,

Hummm? I'd never even thought of that before. I'm so anxious to be out of the Age of Pisces...... I seem to work well when someone askes me something out of the blue like this. After I read your question about Pisces' glyph I had to ponder it a bit. I did my 'thing' and received an interesting insight I think. Now it isn't as flashy as the Aquarius glyph symbology but the Age of Aquarius is pretty special! Here's what I got thanks to your question:

Take your hands and make a circle with the tips of your fingers touching on the top and your thumbs touching on the bottom. See THE Circle........Spirit, the All That Is.
Now slowly separate your hands but keep them in this same Circle shape. You now have 2 half circles facing each other ( ). Slowly move one hand back a bit so you can move it behind and then slowly past the other hand. See THE Circle that's been separated/halved from its Self? Continue slowly moving your hand behind the other one until they start to cross each other. Keep going and watch this image. Keep 'pushing' the one half of THE Circle (one hand) completely past the stationary hand until you have this image ) ( . Take this movement and this image into yourself and Feel, Sense. Here's the 'right brained' aspect of understanding this image. Feeling the symbology instead of thinking about it.

During the Age of Pisces we (humanity) worked on, developed our 'Emotional Bodies'. How it functions, how it feels, how we can be manipulated and deluded even through it by the negative etc. During the past Great Age of Pisces, Spirit was even further separated from Its Self to continue the involuting/learning process. THE Circle split into 2 Halves.......more duality and so on. But-needing to experience this illusion of Seperation from Source, from Spirit, from the All That Is, these 2 half Circles (duality-polarity) were pushed all the way to the point of them not only separating but being back to back ) (. Add to this the horizontal line - of eternal connection with Source, Spirit, the All That Is and the Pisces glyph along with this past Age of Pisces takes on an interesting theme.

O to this () to )( with the - keeping all aspects connected to all aspects all the time no matter what the 'Illusion'.

Humanity was easily manipulated, controlled, directed through its Emotional Body both from the physical and the astral during the past Age of Pisces (2,100+ years). Today this has already changed to our Mental Bodies (Age of Aquarius) and we can see that the 'new god' of this new Aquarian Age is all of the unseen 'waves' and the media in general. This is the new religion unless we get ourselves inbetween those 2 Aquarian lines of frequency AND tap into Leo's high Heart. Is the downfall of Atlantis both in the past and in our near futures? Or are we ready to become The Circle again in these lives?

Ooops got carried away there.

[caninnc]

If you continue the visualization and rotate your hands downwards with arms up to form the ram's horns of Aries...

EXCELLENT!

I like it Lapis! Thanks Radu for getting philosophical!

Michele

[C1]

Lapis,
Thanks for the dance...
and I don't think you got
carried away at the end there....
VVVVVVVVV
C1
VVVVVVVVV