Hit by this year's eclipses

[Byron]

The Solar Eclipse on July 11 will EXACTLY square my Libra Neptune in the 9th House (an orb of zero).

My Neptune in the 9th is quite significant in that:


I am a university teacher.
I teach mostly international students.
Neptune is not only the dispositor of my 2nd House stellium but also in mutual reception with my 2nd House Venus. My income?
Neptune is trine my Sun.
Neptune is my most elevated planet.

At the very same time, Mars will conjoin my South Node, and my Saturn Return will still be in progress (3rd sweep).

The fact that this Neptune/Solar Eclipse square will be EXACT says to me that it is a major crossroads. It must be a very clear lesson I will have to learn...but I don't have the notes to study for this exam.:unsure:

Any comments would be most appreciated.

Byron

[Solastro]

Byron,

As Steve Forrest would say any Neptune transit means your ripe for a new vision of life to come forward for you.. And only time will tell what comes your way.. Also he recommends not making any life altering changes until the transit has gone through it's full cycle.. As Neptune is all about getting a new inspiration in your life.. then later will come the Saturnine decision making time.. ie. Your Saturn return.. a new phase of life beginning.. See *'Saturn in Transit' by Erin Sullivan..

And according to *'The Changing Sky' by Steve.. the 9th house is breaking up routines, learning new things, philosophy.. Ally: A sense of wonder.. Abort Sequence: Dogmatic rigidity, followed by boredom.. while the Lunar Ecplise has just fallen on your 6th house cusp, with the 6th house representing Aquisition of skill; submission to a larger purpose, learning to be useful etc.. Ally: Competence.. Abort Sequence: Sense of inadequacy, followed by drudgery & resentment.. So how to you feel about your life, & about all this.. ie. TO BE OR NOT TO BE.. etc.. Mars passing over Sth Node.. releasing or drawing on something from the past.. in Virgo, the sign of the Annalyst etc.. remembering Mars symbolises our courage.. in the 8th house.. Integration: intensification of feelings, psychic housecleaning.. Ally: Honesty.. Abort Sequence: Resistance, denial, & fear, followed by mental depression.

While this Solar Eclipse will also be trine your 2nd house Pisces stellium with your Nth Node, all in the sign of the Mystic, the Dreamer, the Poet.. how has this aspect of your life been for you.. so far.. in the 2nd house.. of following-through, building inner & outer resources; gaining confidence.. Ally: Conviction.. Abort sequence: The loss of nerve, followed by retreat into the past...

Meanwhile I would also recommend reading *'Yesterdays Sky' by Steve Forrest as well, Virgo Sth Node could be about releasing old guilt.. usually "phoney" guilt with a Virgo Sth Node, according to Steve.. while you have had a number of forces opposing your Sth Node, ie. Jupiter, Venus & Mars in Pisces, suggesting people or ideals opposing you in your past incarnation.. ie. A planet opposing the Sth Node suggests something or someone who blocked, repressed or defeated you in the past. It either represents something insurmountable & irresolvable, or something unattainable. The brick wall of reality. Jupiter opposing could indicate all the good things of life, just out of reach. The Unattainable: Picture a Dickensian orphan, his belly empty - his nose pressed against the steamy glass of the elegant restaurant two nights before Christmas.
The insurmountable: Imagine the King, ie. Jupiter, has declared war, & a gentle poet is conscripted into the army. He hates it. He does not believe in it. He didn't choose it. But how can you argue with the overwhelming might & authority of the King? etc..

Also look at your *prog Moon, having just entered the quiet nurturing sign of Cancer.. & moving into your 6th house.. time to nurture your Self, & clean up your life, mind, body & Soul.. thet *prog Moon being where our heart is.. While it is also applying to Uranus in Cancer.. ie. Who an I? & What do I really want? The prog Moon will take 2 & 1/2 years to move through the inner sign of Cancer.. & your 6th house.. While all this too was also opposed by the Capricorn Lunar Eclipse conj *Pluto(r) in your 12th house.. 12th house/Neptune/Pisces stuff.. LETTING GO.. surrendering to the Mystery of Life etc.. Your Pisces Nth Node, conj Jupiter, Venus & Mars.. in the 2nd house.. ie. Your evolutionary destiny... NB: I also have a thread here I did on the Lunar Eclipse with reference to 'The Book of Pluto' by Steve Forrest.. ie. Moon-Pluto events...

Ok then, hope that makes some sense..

[Byron]

Thank you, Solastro!

You have really helped me "connect the dots"!

It had been my instinct just to keep my eyes and heart open, to exert my will as little as possible, and to make no major moves or decisions until this Eclipse square my Neptune was done...and you have confirmed my "gut feeling".

THANK YOU for pointing out that this Eclipse will also trine my NN and my Pisces stellium. I had completely overlooked that in my concerned focus on the square to my Neptune. Amazing how blind we can be to the positive when we get obsessed with what we believe is negative.

It seems obvious to me now that the Eclipse will shatter my old illusions and out-dated perceptions, and Mars will "burn up" the old karmic contracts of debt that go with them, and a new insight and vision will rise from the ashes like a phoenix. And my Saturn Return will force me to turn my back on the past and get on with my new life and vision.

Yes, I was opposed by many for good reason in an earlier incarnation (much of which I remember well), but now the debt is paid, and it's time to move on to a new freedom. I've been feeling for some time that my debts must have been paid by now, and it is time to release myself from a "phoney" sense of guilt.

I clearly need to leave behind the old Virgo SN self-analysis, measurement, and critiquing (amply supported by my Capricorn Ascendant), and move in the direction of my NN and Pisces stellium - to value and embody Coleridge's "willing suspension of disbelief", "triumph of enchantment made real" - to dream true.

There is an old Gandalf inside me, waiting to be reborn - changing from grey to white. BRING IT, BALROG!

And thanks again, Solastro!

Byron

[Solastro]

Yes... I am also feeling the force of the current Eclipses.. I also added some stuff to my earlier post about your *prog Moon in Cancer, entering your 6th house.. Notes from the Sage, Steve Forrest's book 'The Changing Sky'... which I have also been referring to quite a bit again lately.. along with 'The Book of Pluto' etc..

Ok then, all the best with following "Source" energy.. wherever it leads you...

[Byron]

Just to report back about what has happened since the Solar Eclipse on July 11th exactly square my Neptune (very strong in my chart), followed by the completion of my Saturn Return on August 17th.

I was eagerly anticipating a new, more realistic view of my life, a shedding of false illusions, deceptions, and unnecessary "baggage", and honestly, a new start, a new door to open, a new phase of life to begin.

What has actually happened is that I have experienced a surprising (and disturbing) loss of enthusiasm for my work and hope for my future. All my former dreams of an ultimate success or significant achievement now seem like ridiculous pipe dreams. I no longer feel happy or inspired in front of a roomful of students. I have a textbook half finished that I cannot whip myself into finishing now. I have a fantasy novel in progress whose story I can't continue--my imagination has just dried up.

I seem incapable of the creativity I had before the Eclipse square, no matter how hard I try. Everything I'm depending on to do my work now is something I created prior to the Eclipse square my Neptune. I haven't been able to create anything new since then. All I feel now is confusion and an inability to organize my thoughts--which is definitely the negative side of Neptune...with the positive side gone.

I did not expect the Eclipse square to be so devastating--it was very subtle, and it took me quite a while to realize that a good part of me was just "gone".

I am worried that this is a permanent loss of my ability to enjoy my work as a teacher and writer, to aspire and create ever again.

Byron

(My chart is in my profile.)

[BobZemco]

I don't think the eclipse had anything to do with it.

If you read, you'll find that the Romans reviewing Ptolemy's star list ignored Canopus. Why? Canopus is in the southern sky and you can't see it from Rome. You have to be on the other side of the Med to see Canopus and even then it just skirts the horizon, so the Romans didn't believe Canopus exerted any influence over natives in chart because it couldn't be seen.

Likewise, Abu Ma'shar's charts for eclipses you'll notice there are a few years when he doesn't do eclipse charts, and even in the years he does to eclipse charts, he only does one or maybe two. That's because if you can't see the eclipse, it has no bearing on you. The Ancients make it quite clear that in order for an eclipse to have any effect, it has to be visible in the sky to you.

[Byron]

The Ancients also believed that the Earth was the center of the Universe and didn't know that Uranus, Neptune and Pluto were out there. If an Eclipse which isn't visible has no effect, we could infer that since the Sun, Moon, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, and Uranus weren't visible at my birth, they and their aspects and transits have had no effect on me.

[Inside Out Orange]

The Ancients also believed that the Earth was the center of the Universe and didn't know that Uranus, Neptune and Pluto were out there.

If an Eclipse which isn't visible has no effect, we could infer that since the Sun, Moon, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, and Uranus weren't visible at my birth, they and their aspects and transits have had no effect on me.

But if we were to infer that we'd probably be wrong since they are only a single planet.

The power of an eclipse is that if you can see it, it's because the sun&moon are in a straight line to you; so their powers are being magnified.

[Byron]

But if we were to infer that we'd probably be wrong since they are only a single planet.

In my case, seven planets, if we refer to the Sun and Moon as planets for convenience sake. And three of my seven that were not visible at my birth are in conjunction.

And conjunction is just what an Eclipse is - a perfect conjunction (longitude and latitude) of the two Luminaries.

Does my conjunction of Venus, Mars and Jupiter count for nothing because it was not visible in the sky at my birth? Let me assure you that that conjunction very definitely DOES influence who I am, albeit not visible in the sky when I was born.

If one were born during a Solar Eclipse that occurred below the horizon, would we say that it has no special effect on that individual because it was not visible? I think many astrologers would disagree, saying that an eclipse, whether visible or not at the point of birth, is highly significant in a birth chart.

The power of an eclipse is that if you can see it, it's because the sun&moon are in a straight line to you; so their powers are being magnified.

This is just my take, but this seems to be a pre-astronomy concept - that if something is not visible, it can't affect us (just because we are visually ignorant of its occurrence). If we accept that any planets, aspects, transits and houses below the horizon have ANY effect in our birth charts, we HAVE to allow that a perfect conjunction of the two major Luminaries, a.k.a. "eclipse", also affects us, even if it occurs below the horizon.

Like any any transits, eclipses (whichever side of the Earth they occur) affect the magnetosphere, gravity, or vibrations of our entire planet, just as the Moon when it's invisible on the exact opposite side of Earth from us still causes high tide on our side of the planet.

Limiting the effects of eclipses to only those that can be seen above the horizon seems to me, in my humble opinion, to be a regression to a very primitive stage of celestial understanding.

[Culpeper]

This is the astrological rule for eclipses: They must be visible to be effective. If conjunct the natal chart Sun or Moon position there might be something, but otherwise just consider this another lunation. This is only for eclipses.

I have a prominent Neptune myself and wish it would do more for me. However, it is always a disapointment.

You mention that you are having a Saturn return. This transit activates natal Saturn in the worst way and is well documented for all kinds of difficulties. In addition on July 31 there was a conjuction of Mars and Saturn. This according to Guido Bonatti is always malefic and would have increased the malefic effects of your natal Saturn.

[BobZemco]

If one were born during a Solar Eclipse that occurred below the horizon, would we say that it has no special effect on that individual because it was not visible?

Yes, that is exactly what we would say and there's no astrology to the contrary.

The July 11 Solar eclipse was at 19° Can 23' which is conjunct Mars conjunct the Ascendant of the US Federal Reserve Chart at 19° Can 32'

Did anyone see me posting garbage saying the US Federal Reserve would collapse?

No, of course not, because the eclipse was not visible in the US and therefore it has absolutely no effect whatsoever on the US Federal Reserve or the US or any person living or dead in the US. And as it stands, none of the real astrologers even mentioned it, because it was a non-event, because...the eclipse was not visible in the US.

Even if the eclipse had been visible in the US, it takes months before the effects of a solar eclipse manifest themselves so there's no possible way you're being affected by a solar eclipse that occurred just 6 weeks ago.

Worse than that, Cancer is a Mutable Sign so the effects will come and go and come and go, unlike Fixed Signs where the effects steadily worsen once they begin, which is usually 6 - 9 months after the eclipse.

For a lunar eclipse, sure, the effects often start almost (that's almost) immediately but don't last long. In a Cardinal sign a lunar eclipse would be over in 3-4 weeks.

The Ancients also believed that the Earth was the center of the Universe and didn't know that Uranus, Neptune and Pluto were out there.

That isn't exactly true. The Sumerians and Akkadians had a heliocentric system with all planets, including Pluto, and had star tables for all planets and even star systems we didn't disover until recently. You can see them in Journal of Ancient Near Eastern Texts, Journal of Assyriology et al. and distances were measured in 3 different ways, two of which are not well-understood because it's a relation of time and distance, but the 3rd is a unit of measure equating to about 11,000 meters and as Scientific American pointed out in a review of the star tablets, where there are differences between the distances now and then, Sumerians weren't wrong rather the stars moved.

The Eastern Greeks knew that as well from the writings of Berossus who got his info from the Sumerians and Akkadians via the Chaldeans (Neo-Babylonians) but it got lost and garbled in translation between the Eastern Greeks and the Western Greeks who gave us the idiotic flat earth, non-heliocentric solar system, "Hades" and diseases are caused by colored gases (Aristotle wasn't really all that bright).

[Byron]

This is the astrological rule for eclipses: They must be visible to be effective. If conjunct the natal chart Sun or Moon position there might be something, but otherwise just consider this another lunation. This is only for eclipses.

I have searched and searched for this, but I cannot find an astrological definition of an eclipse which states flatly that an Eclipse must be visible to have any effect. I AM willing to learn, but at this point, since I feel such a loss of my positive Neptunian energies, I'm not quite yet ready to totally concede. (Okay, and I have an obnoxiously stubborn Taurus Moon and 'know-it-all' Aquarius Sun, too.) :pinched:

BobZemco, I do agree that the effects of the Eclipse square my Neptune did not hit promptly at all. On the day it occurred, I experienced no difference at all - it was like "Well, that wasn't so bad. Didn't feel a thing." But the loss of creativity, imagination, and interest in 9th House affairs (my university teaching, for example) seems to have grown gradually, insidiously, each day since then.

Okay, here are just the online references where I've looked for "eclipse must be visible to be effective" and can not find it. But I am so fuzzy-headed these days, I admit that I may be missing the obvious:

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/dictionary/eclipse.php (http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/../dictionary/eclipse.php)

http://www.astrologyzone.com/forecasts/eclipse.html

http://www.cafeastrology.com/lunationseclipses.html
In fact, this one actually describes the effects of an eclipse occurring in the 6th House, as it happened in mine. I quote from this page: "If 19 Cancer [the Eclipse] is in the sixth house, you are called upon to deal with the the details and practicalities of everyday life, to become more organized...." Unfortunately, it doesn't say anything about squaring one's prominent natal Neptune at the same time.

http://www.aquariuspapers.com/astrology/2010/07/the-solar-eclipse-at-20-cancer-july-11-12-2010-pt-1---who-does-it-affect-and-for-how-long.html
Okay, here we're getting close. I quote: "In eclipse lore, [emphasis mine] where the Eclipse is visible will be where the greatest [emp. mine] effects can be expected, lasting the number of years that the eclipse is long in hours." (Robert Wilkinson) However, this statement does not rule out that the Eclipse has effects (though lesser) all over the planet.

Culpeper, maybe these lesser effects (which I am now conceding to) outside the visible zone, is what you were telling me by "just consider this another lunation."

I have a prominent Neptune myself and wish it would do more for me. However, it is always a disapointment. I certainly empathize with you there! Do I ever know Neptunian disappointment! So many idealizations and dreams that have come to absolutely nothing.

You mention that you are having a Saturn return. This transit activates natal Saturn in the worst way and is well documented for all kinds of difficulties. In addition on July 31 there was a conjuction of Mars and Saturn. This according to Guido Bonatti is always malefic and would have increased the malefic effects of your natal Saturn.

My Saturn Return separated from its third conjunction on August 17th. But your observations are very apropos. For several months, it has been a miserable time for me, involving the agonizing deaths of two elderly loved ones, the loss of my relationship with my last sibling, the collapse of my old but good car, having to reckon with a number of unhappy consequences of past decisions, feeling trapped in an old rut that I've been in for 30 years...the classic bad Saturn Return. And the Mars/Saturn conjunction conjunct my Saturn?? I won't even get started on that - dreadful. :w00t: You have got all this spot on.

And now, Jupiter is exactly opposite my "return beaten" Saturn. Rough. Paralyzing.

So what I'd like to ask any of you is to point me in the direction of more outside information on "an Eclipse must be visible to have an effect". I may just have to concede that all this other s*** is at the root of my current "dry spell", "writer's block", etc.

Actually, that would be good, since I assume that Eclipses have a much longer effect. The Eclipse on August 11, 1999 (conjunct my Pluto and opposite my Sun) which WAS visible where I was, eventually "gutted" my whole life, and I basically had to start over in every way. It's like everything prior to 2000 was another incarnation, another lifetime - no part of my current life.

Thanks for your patience and informativeness despite my stubbornness.

Byron

(My chart is in my profile. It's in American format, but it does have my DOB stats.)

[Caro]

Hi Byron

have read some of your messages prevously.

I must admit for some reason I have been pondering this years eclipses more than previously yet none of my natal planets are aspected by it. I cant help on the research but keep digging and hopefully someone will reply. I dont think it is about seeing either. I see the eclipse as with all the aspects as a form of energy. its this energy that can effect your life etc. .

the shift of uranus and jupiter to aries was unexpectedly quite volatile for me. yet again nothing is aspected in my natal chart. however as an aqua with a prominent uranus conjunct pluto I always find uranus tries to send me messages.

the reason for my post is your reference is to aug 1999 and your gutting of your life. this was a very significant time for me too. a previous eclipse here. which was much talked about in the media. it was very visible in the Uk and there was a small period of complete darkness in parts of the uk in the middle of the day.

however , I only read this recently that there was a grand cross in fixed signs around this time too. I AM also an aqua sun. I felt like I was being gutted. saturn was in taurus. however the result I turned my life inside out.

there are as you know grand crosses in cardinal signs now and the eclipses recently are connecting into that.

I havent looked at your chart but maybe the alignement is prompting you to make the final changes to what ever came up back in 1999.

[Inside Out Orange]

Worse than that, Cancer is a Mutable Sign so the effects will come and go and come and go, unlike Fixed Signs where the effects steadily worsen once they begin, which is usually 6 - 9 months after the eclipse.

For a lunar eclipse, sure, the effects often start almost (that's almost) immediately but don't last long. In a Cardinal sign a lunar eclipse would be over in 3-4 weeks.

Bob ... I'm assuming that you've been typing quicker than your lightning Gemini brain again ...

Cancer is cardinal ... how does that affect what you wrote?

[BobZemco]

Bob ... I'm assuming that you've been typing quicker than your lightning Gemini brain again ...

Cancer is cardinal ... how does that affect what you wrote?

You get the Eagle Eye Award. Thanks for pointing that out. Cancer is a Moveable Sign (aka Cardinal Sign). The effects are fleeting, but for Mutable Signs (aka Common Signs) those are off and on.

[Byron]

I dont think it is about seeing either. I see the eclipse as with all the aspects as a form of energy. its this energy that can effect your life etc.

Thanks, Caro. Talking with more astrologers, the overall consensus seems to be somewhere in the middle - yes, an eclipse is more powerful on those to whom it is visible, but like any major transit conjunction that aspects your chart (in this case, the most powerful transit conjunction possible), it still affects everyone on the planet in one way or another.

the reason for my post is your reference is to aug 1999 and your gutting of your life. this was a very significant time for me too....I only read this recently that there was a grand cross in fixed signs around this time too. I AM also an aqua sun. I felt like I was being gutted. saturn was in taurus. however the result I turned my life inside out.

So sorry that happened to you, too! Yes, "turned my life inside out" is another good way to describe what happened to me in the months following that 1999 eclipse. While it hit my Aquarius Sun/Leo Pluto opposition and merely wiped out my entire life as I had known it, it hit my Taurean brother's natal Fixed Grand Cross, and his life was totally devastated--he ended up killing himself in 2002 at the age of 47. Yes, I believe in the power of eclipses!

The fact that my strong Neptune trines my Sun and sextiles my Pluto (and the 1999 Eclipse) probably saved me. I still had dreams of a new life, rising like a phoenix, though everything around me was falling apart. Neptune's dreams helped me make it through, but as Culpeper said, the outcome was ultimately disappointing--I survived and things were eventually "okay", but not as wonderful as they had been before the Eclipse nor as I had dreamed they would be again.

there are as you know grand crosses in cardinal signs now and the eclipses recently are connecting into that. I havent looked at your chart but maybe the alignement is prompting you to make the final changes to what ever came up back in 1999.

Yes, my Saturn Return this year was part of the Cardinal Grand Cross! Talk about a rotten setup for a Saturn Return. It's mostly over now, the elderly loved ones have died, the demons of the past have come and been dealt with, I have grieved and learned many lessons--some of which I must admit were tied to the events of 1999...hmm...that IS an interesting point you bring up, Caro!

My concern about the recent eclipse squaring my Neptune is still that my Neptunian energy feels "dead"--and it feels like something entirely separate from the real pain of the Saturn Return. It doesn't hurt...it just feels "numb"...like there's no inspiration, no creativity, no aspirations. I must admit that t. Venus recently conjoining my Neptune truly felt like some life was returning there. But now...zilch. I just work, sleep, and write too much on astrology forums. :whistling:

Byron

[dr. farr]

Karl Marx was born (May 5th 1818) in lower Prussia, right on an eclipse: the path of this eclipse completely missed Prussia but covered most of what later became known as the Soviet Union: Charles Carter goes into the Marx nativity in this relation, and compares several similar instances where, at a certain nativity connected with an eclipse, although the location of the nativity was not in the path of the eclipse, those areas actually in the eclipse path can be much affected by that native. An interesting outlook, especially coming from a careful source like Carter, who tended to back up his observations with what we today would call "statistical" evidence...

[Byron]

This is fascinating info, Dr. Farr. I—like Jung, Gauquelin, and Carter—really go in for statistical evidence. Thank you!

Byron

[dr. farr]

Byron:
If you have not read them already, you might find Carter's "Astrology of Accidents" and his "Encyclopedia of Psychological Astrology", of much interest: although Carter's "statistics" don't meet the exacting standards used today, nonetheless he did make an attempt in these two books to see where the tabulated cases "astrologically pointed" in a wide variety of types of accidents, psychological conditions, physical illnesses, etc.

[Caro]

Hi Byron. sorry to hear about your brother.
thanks for replying to my not very technical response! merc retrograde opp my natal merc in pisces is my excuse.
my brother also a taurus sun 8th May, had a really difficult time too(post 1999), a divorce and depression. my brother now does not really speak to me(a recent decision). I told him some home truths in 2002. An aqua and a taurus - eh always arguing. I have pluto transit to 3rd currently,
uranus and jupiter in aries would have been in opposition too your natal neptune- is that right? so the tug of war between saturn the old and uranus the new. are you moving towards new technology - 3rd house stuff. new ways of communicating.
Is the feeling of disillusionment you feel the affect of the saturn moving closer to natal neptune. making you take a hard look at the life you have built through 9th house neptune. saturn is very grounding. perhaps it will shift the emphasis of y our work. where is saturn natally?
I have saturn in pisces and the shift I made in 1999 was a move to more interest in spiritual way of life/awareness.
I wish I had more time to do research - Dr Farr's suggested reading sounds very interesting.
very very busy at work so must get on.................