Pallas Athenae and general influence of asteroids to you

[labelledujour]

Hi all once again!

I don't usually boggle my mind with those so-called asteroids, in fact I only use Chiron, but this one could not be passed up since it is quite the influential one, connecting strongly with some of my natals! Yet, I've read that Pallas can be associated with incest, along with the warrior spirit and intellect (correct me if I'm wrong!) I'm still trying to figure out what that means in my case, and any help will be appreciated, yet I'd like to ask you which asteroid in your chart seems to form the most & powerful aspects within your chart and how does it manifest in you? Thanks!! :cool:

[07.Re]

Hi Labelledujour

These three are probably the most powerful aspects in my chart:

* I have Pallas conjunct my ascendant (exact)
* Ceres conjuncts my Sun / Uranus
* Psyche conjuncts my Sun (exact conjunction) and Moon. Psyche is also referred to as the Goddess of the Soul.

To be honest, I'm not sure what influence they have, but like you, I'm hoping to find out.

http://www.bobmarksastrologer.com/Pallas21.2.html (http://www.bobmarksastrologer.com/Pallas21.2.html)

http://www.llewellyn.com/journal/article/1303 (http://www.llewellyn.com/journal/article/1303)

:)

[waybread]

I confess I haven't done a lot of reading on astrological Pallas. Mythologically she was a warrior goddess, often depicted by the Greeks with a helmet, spear, and shield. So she's not a maternal, feminine type like Ceres or Juno. Pallas was the goddess of crafts, intellectual pursuits, and certain types of mental activity; so I see her as kind of a Mercury/Mars combo. I read once that she is prominent in charts of autistic children.

Bob Marks [ www.bobmarksastrologer.com (http://www.bobmarksastrologer.com) ] says she is the ability to see patterns and re-arrange things. While I don't dispute this, I think Pallas is more than this. www.aquamoonlight.co.uk/pallas.html (http://www.aquamoonlight.co.uk/pallas.html) does associate Pallas with incest, but I doubt it. It seems more Plutonian, but then one would have to check out a lot of charts and just see what shows up.

The "experts" don't seem to agree, so there's lots of room for new studies here.

[airgoddess]

I like how waybread described her, as like a mercury/mars combo. As for the incest thing, I think that comes up because Pallas rules the father-daughter relationship, and incest would could be considered the (very) low vibration of that relationship.

I wonder for you, do you have the ability to make decisions quickly? It would seem so in Aries, but then it's square your Cancer mercury . . . do you often feel conflicted when making decisions?

As for myself, I have Cupido almost exactly on my sun. Interesting to me since it's a higher octave of venus but lower than neptune, and neptune's my most prominent planet, with venus in second. Almost everything I've read on Cupido applies to me; I think it just reaffirms and amplifies the influence of neptune and venus on me.

[Bjorkstrand]

Pallas has to do with graphics which "shows" wisdom. I have it opposing the sun, for 22 years i was a cartographer.
An astro chart is pallas.
The way this forum is laid out by the owner of this website has to do with pallas and it a lot bigger have chiron. 3 times the size.
If you read Asteroid Goddesses by Demetra George, she mentions the graphics element.

Jim

[waybread]

Cool. Jim have you checked out asteroids Geographos [1620], Geometria [376] and Mercator [4798] in your chart?

[Bjorkstrand]

dear waybread
Those objects are too small. I don't use chiron. But eros is close to the sun.
Vesta is conjunct my moon, venus, eros and shapley 8. She is all about purity.

Jim

[Lunar Pisces]

Pallas doesn't seem to be too much an influence in my chart. I have it at 4 Tau in my 8th, and it's semisextile my Venus (exact) and novile my Moon (within 2 degrees).

I have a few interesting, tight asteroid aspects though:

Sun conjunct Eros
Sun conjunct Ceres
Venus conjunct Saturn with Amor wedged in between, and opposing Neptune (singleton) cj. Jupiter
Venus trine Vesta
Moon conjunct Diana
Moon trine Psyche
Mars cj. NN with Aphrodite wedged in between
Eros parallel Psyche
Eros conjunct Pan

[Modcleopatra]

Hi All,

I am very interested in asteroids, and believe they add fun and worthwhile details to the natal picture. I liken their use to the Mona Lisa. The Mona Lisa has been studied and revered for the woman's penetrating quality. We all stare at her, but yet, no matter how we position ourselves, she seems to stare right back at us. The theory? She has no eyebrows. It is a small, seemingly inconsequential detail, which impacts the entire painting as a whole, and without which, the painting may have never been quite so touted.

I am interested, specifically in this post about Pallas Athena, because of the thread's discussion on incest as it relates to her natal presence. Pallas Athena, also known simply as Athena, was born from the head of Zeus-- quite literally a splitting headache! She was born in his image alone, and through his imagination, which of course, has to do with the mind. She is, in effect, an extension of Zeus and his own mental image, much like how Parents see themselves in their Children. "You are my creation," and creation begins with a mental concept.

Incest, particularly through direct familial lines (Mother-Son, Father-Daughter, Father-Son, Mother-Daughter), has a lot do with the narcissism, and the story of Narcissisus. The Parents who pursue their Children sexually, are incredibly narcissistic, that is to say, totally absorbed in the self they see in their own Children. It is of course, the imagined self. I'm not suggesting that one's Children do not actually have qualities similar to their parents, but the Children do not belong to the Parents, the way a Narcissistic Parent, believes on some level, that the similarities they see in their Child must be loved and cherished in an obsessive way. The Parent longs to be one with that Child again.

Usually what happens in these cases, and to some degree, understandable, as it is fairly common and part of familial bonding, is a form of Emotional Incest takes place. This Parent-Child identification turns the Child into the desired counterpart of the Parent, also known as a surrogate spouse. This doesn't always end up sexual, in fact it usually doesn't, and most of us can think of a few instances in which these boundaries were blurred with our own Parents, and maybe with our Children.

I promise I'm going to talk about Astrology shortly.

When it becomes sexual is when the Parent becomes absorbed in achieving oneness with the Child. "You have a piece of Me, a piece that is Mine, give it back," or, "We share this, so we should share a special connection," or, it turns into a deep-seated issue of power (i.e. often why we quote Pluto in issues of Incest, since Incest is both a taboo and about Power), "I own you, you are mine, and you are me, so I shall have you as a I want." These attitudes underlie healthy Parent-Child relationships as well as unhealthy ones. Typically they become sublimated, but in overtly incestual ones, they come to a head and handled in a way that the Parent so chooses, and perhaps on some level, the Child encourages, if only because the Child relies on the parent.Achieving this Oneness, this control, is often best done through sexual means. This alone, isn't a problem, it just is what it is. We do it any sexual relationship we engage in. Control isn't always a bad thing, it is simply an extension of a desired Union, and it typically isn't at all conscious. "Be Mine."

With all of this said, however, if we look to Pallas Athena, there are a few things to consider. I, myself, as many people in this forum know, am an Incest Survivor. I am not going to into the details, but I will share what is pertinent as it relates to our understanding of Athena, since we are all here to learn.

My Pallas Athena is in a 29 degrees, in Leo, in the 8th house.

Pluto is in my 10th house, in Scorpio, conjunct the MC by a two degree orb. Pluto Squares my Sun in Cancer, and my Mercury in Leo.

One of my perpetrators was my maternal Grandfather, whom I believe is represented by the 6th house. The 6th house is ruled by Mercury, and Mercury disposits Athena. Chiron is also there in Gemini, wounding my Venus in Virgo in the 8th house, which tends to give the native childlike qualities towards sex--- almost like a stunting if you will.


well... I sort of just vented here... sorry.


mod.

[jolou]

My daughter and I both have Pallas in Libra at 24-25 degrees. Mine is 10th house and hers is 9th. I associated it with my tendency and ability to put together clothing in an unusual and distinctive way. My daughter learned that from me but her style is different, more refined. I hope I am not a narcissistic mother.

Hmmm. I just looked at my son's chart. He is autistic and Pallas seems to be at the apex of a kite formation. I will post an attachment if anybody is interested. 26.29 Cancer, conjunct Chiron and Jupiter.

I am interested in the asteroids but try not to play with them too much since I am still learning the basics. I do use my personal name asteroid and another one that I came upon accidentally, and for me, they always show up in synastry charts.

[Pallas-trine-Mars]

Hey, nice birth month! ;) Pallas is mild, skilled, organized and for the most part modest, and since it's in your second house I'm guessing this must apply to your approach to handling your possessions and money:

Pallas prominent:

1. Julia Child - Pallas combust in Leo
2. Marcia Cross - Pallas conjunct Sun in Aries in the Midheaven
3. Martha Stewart - Pallas rising in Scorpio and the Ascendant
4. Vanessa Williams - Pallas tightly conjunct Ascendant in Cancer

Pallas can definitely have a cool, dry, highly left-brained steeliness

http://thinkculture.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/vanessa_williams.jpg

Jolou, yes, I've seen a couple of charts of people with Pallas rising that has mental and compulsive disorders like Aspergers. My brother has Pallas just beyond orbs of conjunction with his Ascendant and he has these problems as well and I've also seen the flat, coolness of Pallas in the face of a Leo I've met with Pallas opposite his Sun. Bob Marks might've been right in more ways than one when he or whoever first connected Pallas with patterns, in this case neurological and probably health patterns, and similar things things like routines, rituals and scheduling. I have Pallas quincunx my Ascendant and suspect I might have OCD.

[freedomlover]

Hey, nice birth month! ;) Pallas is mild, skilled, organized and for the most part modest, and since it's in your second house I'm guessing this must apply to your approach to handling your possessions and money:

Pallas prominent:

1. Julia Child - Pallas combust in Leo
2. Marcia Cross - Pallas conjunct Sun in Aries in the Midheaven
3. Martha Stewart - Pallas rising in Scorpio and the Ascendant
4. Vanessa Williams - Pallas tightly conjunct Ascendant in Cancer

Jolou, yes, I've seen a couple of charts of people with Pallas rising that has mental and compulsive disorders like Aspergers, so Bob Marks might've been right in more ways than one when he or whoever first connected Pallas with patterns, in this case neurological and probably health patterns, and similar things things like routines, rituals and scheduling. I have Pallas quincunx my Ascendant and suspect I might have OCD.

I found this very interesting. I'm wondering if it applies to things that happen later in life via the Progressed Chart. I have Pallas in Aquarius smack dab on my Progressed Ascendant. It also makes an exact trine to my Progressed Jupiter Rx in Gemini in the 4th house.